Nursing your daughter's baby

Submitted by louiseds on October 30, 2010 - 4:41am
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Hi All

Has anyone ever nursed another woman's baby?

What about your own grandchild?

If you were looking after your daughter's baby and the baby was fretting, despite trying all the normal solutions, would you try and calm her by putting her to your dry breast? And would you tell your daughter afterwards?

angel2me

October 30, 2010 - 3:12pm

It is not uncommon for a baby to be breastfed by a woman other than the biological mother. But I would ask my daughter first if she was okay with it before I would do that. That is so interesting because I was thinking about this same thing myself the other day. I loved breastfeeding my kiddies and miss that so much. That's my 10cents worth.

kiki

October 30, 2010 - 3:16pm

Oh, it's such a personal thing! My feeling would be that I would have to have the ok from the mama. I've had friends who have done it for one another, and were both very happy with it. It's such a natural thing to do to try to calm a baby that way, makes perfect sense, but I would want the mama to be ok with it... In other countries it is completely the norm. In the west it seems to freak people out... if the other mama is lactating, there could be health implications for the baby getting other milk, so that could be an issue, but if you aren't that isn't a problem. it really just comes down to how everyone feels about it.

what do you think Louise?

granolamom

October 30, 2010 - 8:54pm

haven't even done it, but depending on circumstance I would. unless it was dire emergency, I would be sure to have the mother's permission first.
a friend of mine called me a few months ago, horrified. she left her then 3 mo baby with her mom and when she returned, her mother (the grandmother) said baby was inconsolable so she nursed her a bit. its a real issue of boundary crossing, imo, unless as I said its emergency (ie no clean water or available bm and baby will starve) or you have permission from mom.
another friend of mine offered to bf my one year old before bed so I could go overseas for a few days to a wedding. sweet offer, but I declined and wont be going to the wedding, don't want to risk early weaning that way.

I've been tempted to bf other babies, especially when I am newly pp and there's a baby screaming in line behind me at the checkout counter while his mom is chatting on her phone (this happens more often than you'd think!).

louiseds

October 31, 2010 - 12:47am

It seems really sensible to me, but we operate more as individuals in our western society, not primarily members of the same body called the community, so there are thicker boundaries between us, and issues of privacy, cross-infection, TMI and 'what is right and proper'.

There is no ways that a sheep will feed the lamb of another ewe, unless the lamb is particularly cunning and can sneak into a huddle of twins or triplets without being detected. The ewe smells each lamb that comes to suck, if she can, and is not otherwise distracted. You can mother up a lamb to a ewe if she is receptive and you can get the lamb to smell like her lamb, eg by draping the dead lamb's skin or birth membranes over the cuckoo. This is instinct at work.

I am inclined to think that occasional cross-suckling (a real word??) is about comfort, skin contact and sucking as oral stimulation on a nipple, rather than a dummy in the baby's mouth. After all, that is what a dummy is; a dummy, not the real thing. It is not really about the milk and nutrition, for the distressed baby. Sucking on a dry, clean finger would not be different from sucking on a dry breast, but if I was a baby I know which I would choose, skin to skin, held close.

Except that there is no expectation of milk with a finger. It could be quite a confusing experience for a baby, smelling a different, even if familiar, breast, and not being able to milk anything familiar out of it. Perhaps holding close and using a finger would be less confusing for a baby? Babies often take some time to 'understand' dummies, but they do understand them in the end. That is probably why some Mums introduce dummies so early, before the baby really knows what it is doing. That of course, is one of the main reasons for early failure of nursing. The dummy is always there, dangling enticingly on a string, so any old person can pop it in the baby's mouth and silence her cries. When Mum's breast is not offered they can eventually become the preferred option for satisfying the need to suck. You can't tell I hate dummies, can you?

BTW, we call them dummies in Australia, not pacifiers. I think 'pacifier' is a bit too politically correct for us. To use the name Pacifier implies that it is a benign way of pacifying babies, rather than a dummy breast when the real thing is not available. I think it was probably coined by a marketing person who thought that dummy implied trickery (which it certainly does - and don't you forget it!). It is marketed as another consumer tool in the mother's arsenal if she is not prepared to put baby to the breast when she fusses. It is not marketed as a breast substitute, or even as a bottle substitute. It is a gadget in its own right.

A baby sucking on an empty breast is not going to grow too fat, but will get ample oral stimulation which makes her feel good. It is certainly preferable to feeding artificial milk from a bottle. That is where nursing a friend's baby is different from nursing your own grandchild, which is also indirectly fruit of your own loins.

I just had a rabbit thought. I would not have hesitated to offer to feed another woman's baby once off, when I was lactating myself, but I would hesitate to take up another woman's offer to feed my baby, partly because that was my role, and my baby gets my milk, but partly because I didn't want my little piranha to mess up the feeding equilibrium of the other woman's baby.

Now I remember, I was actually asked to nurse the newborn baby of a mum still in hospital postpartum once, when I was visiting the mum on request of the hospital as a volunteer breastfeeding counsellor. The mother was stressed and tense because the baby (only a few days old) wouldn't feed, and the baby was obviously upset by the mother's distressed state. Details are sketchy 25 years later. It would have given the baby a feed of breastmilk so we would have known whether he was crying from hunger or not, or whether he was being put off by his mum's distressed state, or whether the problem was related to the baby, but would not have helped the mother's confidence, or guaranteed that it wouldn't happen at the next feed as well. Of course, I didn't nurse the baby. The Rabbit at the time was "This is the mum's role, not mine. It would be wrong to nurse this baby. I am not a part of this family or their nursing relationship. No!". I didn't even have to reach into my Code of Ethics to look for the answer.

Putting myself in the hypothetical position of being a grandmother, I think DD would go ballistic if I suggested nursing any fussing baby of hers, (that's just my perception of our relationship - she has no babies yet) but I certainly would put the possibility to DD.

A rabbit thought. If DD didn't want me to put her baby to my breast and I was minding her, and she became very fussy, I would strip both of us off and just hold the baby skin to skin on my belly and use a clean finger in the baby's mouth. If the baby grabbed hold of my nipple I would just go all warm and contented and plead innocence if she found me asleep semi-naked with her baby. And I would feel very guilty. Then I would have to deal with the consequences. She has gone ballistic at me before. What's one more ballistic daughter experience in a lifetime?

Another Rabbit thought. A baby sucking on any clean finger is socially acceptable. A baby sucking on the breast publicly is often not socially acceptable. A baby sucking a breast that is not its mother's, publicly or in private, is taboo! Ironically, having a wet nurse used to be a sign of prestige. To be a wet nurse was to have a wage, even if it meant that her own baby was not allowed to share its birthright with the cuckoo nursling, and might die or be grossly malnourished from the effects of pap-feeding. The modern day equivalent, feeding artificial milk from a bottle, while less than perfect, is acceptable to mums whose life decisions and circumstances determine that they spend too much time away from their baby to nurse.

As humans we have the benefit of freedom of choice, vs instinct, so we cannot rely on instinct. Instead we have to work out the best options by logic and analysis of all the factors. IMO, the decisions we make are often coloured more by tradition, superstition, taboo and social mores than they are by objective analysis of the situation.

PS For the uninitiated, I use the term 'rabbit' to describe those unconscious thoughts that we have in difficult situations that conjure up feelings of guilt, shame or fear, or very pleasant or unpleasant emotions from past experiences. We cannot make sense of them in the current situation, so we censor them out of our thoughts as being irrelevant, but the emotions that conjure the irrelevant thoughts stay with us in the present. eg the euphoria we can experience when we taste or smell something from a very pleasant past meal or outing; the emotions stirred by perfumes or particular flowers from times passt. Another eg is the urge to pick up and nurse somebody else's baby because it reaches into our lower level instinctive response to a baby's cry. Another eg is fear of a sexual relationship after sexual assault. Another eg is thinking you have failed (because failure has been a repeated theme in your life), when somebody tells you that you have succeeded. The last two are particularly hard to deal with because they contradict current good-ness'. The concept of 'rabbits' is a key concept in Cognitive Behaviour Therapy, where you learn to de-code these subconscious thoughts, work out where they come from, uncover their irrational nature, and discard them for ever, ie recognise them as being merely distractions from past experiences that need have no power over you if they are not facts in the present.

Sorry 'bout the long rave.

Louise

alemama

October 31, 2010 - 2:28pm

all times with permission.
first with my sisters baby who was making her crazy wanting to nurse to sleep but not actually going to sleep. I loved nursing her baby to sleep. It was good for all of us.
then with my brother's baby when they were visiting and went on a date. The baby got fussy, I nursed her to sleep.
again with a friends baby- who was the exact same age as my baby and they were nursing at the same time- that was so so cool- they were holding hands. The mom was cooking dinner for us all and didn't want to stop.
another friends baby when I was baby sitting- he was older than my baby and I got the shock of my life when he started pushing and pulling to draw more milk, none of mine have done that.

let's see, last year at thanksgiving- my cousins baby- wouldn't take the formula- was screaming for about an hour- I offered to nurse her- he took me up on it- she was extremely content for the rest of the day (the mom was recently back to work).

the best time ever though was my friend who had a c-section, couldn't nurse, the baby was two weeks old, she was pumping and bottle feeding- trying to latch the baby frequently through the day- she was using nipple shields to get her baby to latch on and it was not working. She was suffering from ppd from her failure to birth and nurse. Was not confident at all. I had a theory that the baby was confused about how to suck and would get frustrated and cry at the breast (bottle and breast operate very differently) I offered to help, so she came over, took a good long nap-woke up ready to try again- I watched her try for about half an hour- he was screaming and arching away from her, she was crying. with her permission I latched him onto my breast (that was empty by the way)-and as soon as I felt him settle into a rhythm and get the hang of it I climbed up onto the back of the couch wrapped my arm around her (the one that was not holding her baby) grabbed her breast from underneath, popped the suction from the baby and before he knew what happened we had stuffed her breast into his mouth in a perfect latch and he was nursing. The milk came and and he was swallowing and she was crying. It was amazing. She stayed all day, napped and ate good food and each time he needed to nurse I helped until she got the hang of it. by the end of the day they were experts. He is 2 now and still nurses- she is pregnant again and I am sure this time it will be easy as pie for her to get her baby to latch on.

So I guess I have nursed many that are not my own. Never thought about it before. I have been tested many times for HIV, Hepatitis, and other communicable diseases. I always test clean. I am in a monogamous relationship and have been for a long time. I have never had a blood transfusion, and I am not around blood (like some are in their professions). I take no medication- none- not even tylenol. Basically I am as low risk as it comes. I would not nurse someone's baby if I had thrush in my nipples (something I've had before) and probably wouldn't do it for any extended period of time- the oversupply would not be worth it to me.

I have also donated my milk to a friends baby to drink out of a bottle when she was very sick. I have offered to donate my milk to a friend whose husband was very sick. But she had enough from a few other lactating friends of ours.

When I leave my kids with friends I always give permission for them to nurse the baby if the need comes up. It has not come up. Once when I was out of town I left my baby with my mom and sister- my sister was nursing her daughter at the time- I thought for sure my son would nurse while I was gone- but he didn't, she offered many times and he refused. But took back up when I got back like he never missed a day. He was almost 2 at the time.

Before I had my first child I asked my mom if she would start pumping so she could also nurse the baby- so the baby could spend the night at her house and I could go out. I was so so so so stupid. She refused. Once my baby came I wouldn't even let my mom hold her- no one except me. I was so in love with my baby. I brought her into the bathroom with me- I couldn't be separated for one second. So in the end it was good my mom refused cause it would have been a lot of work for nothing at all.

Christine

October 31, 2010 - 3:20pm

This is an important discussion, Louise - a Grandmother Circle topic, for sure. For me, personally, this was never considered, but I’m not sure why. Was I just not that interested? Did unconscious fear prevent me from thinking about such a thing? Or did my instincts tell me there was social “work” to be done in helping my infant granddaughter begin to understand such things as patience and boundaries. Looking back, I think it would’ve been a social nightmare if she were grabbing at Grammy’s tits too!! I loved breastfeeding and think it plays a primal role in our development as women and crones. For years post-bf I had bf dreams - sometimes my own little children and sometimes other waifs - often in rescue situations. Haven’t had one since menopause - hm-m-m - do you think there is a connection?

Alemama - I just love you. I hope all the mommies who are tangled up in knots with society’s do’s and don’ts can sense the utter safety and freedom of true maternal love. As WW, we have big work to do around guilt and shame (so get ready - lol). I think it should be a forum of its own, because it’s a big part of what makes the world sick. It seems to me that if women aren’t in touch with their own guilt and shame, they are much more likely to guilt-trip and shame other women. The older I get, the more I see this as a major societal issue to be grappled with.

But for now, I have to write two articles for the Village Post!

Hugs from Christine

louiseds

November 1, 2010 - 9:03am

Interesting Christine, I have had quite a few dreams in recent years around menopause about having another baby, but no nursing that I can remember. However, I have also had quite a few about going back to school, but discovering that it was all a bit irrelevant with the benefit of the forty years of real life experience and three grown up kids on top. I think it was probably about leaving part of my life behind and leaving the past in the past and not trying to relive it.

Alemama, what an amazing account of your cross-suckling! I am so proud of you with your disdain of what others might think, and your attitude of not even considering 'why not?'. And you have done it all so shamelessly. I would like to think that I would be just as shameless next time I am on this Earth, and have the good fortune to be born female. Of course, it is just such a commonsense thing to do, as long as you are prepared to do the safe blood practices and blood hygiene testing to ensure the safety of our milk for another's baby.

Interesting story about your Mum during your first pregnancy. As a grandmother I would be so honoured that my daughter would trust me that much, and, as you say, why not? Grandma pumping? I'm not so sure about that, but I would certainly make myself available, and do some nipple prep! What a privilege it would be. It makes me realise how much I loved nursing our babies. I got wet eyes just thinking about it.

Grandmothers tell me how besotted they become with their grandbabies. I find it hard to imagine, but no doubt I will be the same one day. I hope so. I can just see myself stealing off down the paddock with a grandbaby under my arm, like a benevolent old witch, just so I can have some private grandbaby time. DD and I have a few jealousy issues I think, but that is a whole nuther topic!!!

Louise

teebar

November 1, 2010 - 9:06pm

Yes I did this once when my friend and I, both nursing mothers of young babies (3 mos.) traveled out of town together. We took turns going inside somewhere that did not allow children and we had agreed to help each other should our baby become inconsolable.

As far as a mother and daughter situation, it would depend on their relationship. Some daughters might feel threatened that their mother was trying to take over or that that she didn't feel that her daughter was doing a good job even if that was not the intent. Postpartum women do not think rationally all of the time plus our culture does not view breastfeeding as the natural part of life that it is. It is too bad that this thread has to be discussed given that the grandma just wants to do what is right for the baby.

new_mamma

November 3, 2010 - 9:17am

Its kinda interesting because just yesterday one of my bestfriends tried tp bf feed my son! Well it didn't sit well with me! I asked her to please not and thankfully she respected that.

I am anti formula and in this culture a lot of my friends are annoyed by me and my 'old fashioned' beliefs on mothering. Breastfeeding is intimate and helps a mother and her baby to bond.

To breastfeed your grandchild (or any other child) and either not ask permission or do it secretly is extremely disrespectful! If the daughter never left her child in your care again I would understand! It breaks trust and leaves a mom uncertain of what else you would do! To shame a mom for not being comfortable with this is rude and unthoughtful.

a soother is a replacement for a mothers breast... but so is yours! Your breast will feel, smell and taste different. There are a lot of babies that will not even latch onto a breast that is not there mothers. When you supplement a baby with your breastmilk you do the same thing as bottle feeding formula! You diminsh a mothers milk supply. Your nipple is different then the mothers and do you think it cannot cause nipple confusion in a newborn the same as a soother? My son never had a soother until we established a good latch and we were one mean eating breastfeeding team.

It is different when a mom is comfortable with you breastfeeding her baby. I find it interesting how many women would be ok breastfeeding another baby but not being ok with someone bf there baby. Does that not say something?

I think the important thing is that respect is given whatever a moms preference is. I wouldn't let another woman breastfeed my son because how can I know she doesn't have HIV or something like that. If I had to choose between formula and another womans breastmilk I would choose the breastmilk. First would come a testing to ensure that the milk will be safe and then I big pump! That's me tho. If a mom would rather have her baby put to another womans breast I support that if her decision is imformed. Anything is better then formula but nothing is worse then a woman or grandmother sneaking our behind another moms back! That's pathetic and extremely unfortunate!

Christine

November 3, 2010 - 9:30am

Thank you, new_mamma, for these insights. I think we have to carefully consider the emotional reactions of a young mother! Because they are about as natural as it gets. A 23 year-old does not have a ton of world experience and her judgments are coming from a place deep inside where things are pretty strictly “maternal”. I know what it is like to be a young mother with all your alarms going off - it is deep, primeval and to be trusted. Thanks for sharing with us! (((((hugs))))))

louiseds

November 4, 2010 - 1:16am

Hi New_mamma
I can see that some of my words have stirred you to post a reply.

I hope you don't think I would actually do these things that I described as 'rabbit thoughts'. That is exactly as I see them; thoughts that I admit, often shamefully, that I do think briefly, when making decisions, but that I too dismiss them as not even worth paying attention to in real life. I really am gob-smacked at some of the thoughts that come out of my feral mind! All of us have such capacity for doing damage as well as doing good.

However, they are very useful to consider in depth outside of their real life context, because they help us to realise what bad decisions we can make if we don't think critically about the consequences of these thoughts for our relationships with others, including babies.

Yes, you are right in all you say. I agree with you completely. I wouldn't really steal off down the paddock with my daughter's baby tucked under my arm. That was just a mischievous, animated visualisation, straight out of an imaginative fairytale.

The good fairy would, later in the story ensure that I met with a sticky end and that the baby was rightfully returned to her mother, the nursing Queen. The baby would eventually grow up to be wise and strong, and be crowned a worthy queen in her own right with a handsome prince for a husband at her side. They would all live happily ever after.

Respectfully, Louise.

aza

November 4, 2010 - 2:09pm

I love your story, alemama. Simply brilliant :)

I live in a community where cross-nursing happens more frequently than in the mainstream, and even then, it is not that common. Mostly there is simply no need, but if there is, it would be a no-brainer for most women I know. I remember one 4 hr old newborn whose mum was about to go into surgery for a massive fibroid which proved problematic after birth, and the hungry baby was nursed by a friend who was still feeding her toddler. That friend still feels a strong connection to that baby to this day, which is an interesting aspect of bonding between women and our young. We throw around phrases like 'it takes a village to raise a child' but really, this is a hard motif to live by in a culture that is far more individualised than collective.

I hear you on the anti-formula thing, new_mamma. While there are still lactating women in the world, there is NO need for fake food.

new_mamma

November 5, 2010 - 12:53pm

As I've said I am anti formula but my question is this... Why would you want to have another woman nurse your baby when you have enough yourself? Why would you want another woman bonding with your child in such an intimate way? This I don't understand... I just don't see why you would want some other woman 'mothering' your child in this way...

aza

November 5, 2010 - 2:06pm

See the example I mentioned below, new_mamma. I know for a fact that in that case, everyone in the room (particularly the mother as she was headed into surgery) was so relieved that a newborn was given the comfort of another woman's breasts and milk rather than formula few with a plastic bottle.

Other women I know who have crossed nursed have not seemed to be bothered by it. It is not like it is a continuing habit but more of a one-off that is the best for the child at the time, for whatever reason (i.e. playing at a friends house, has a fall or an owie and looks for a boob for consolation. If mum is not there, the breasts of a sister or friend are the next best thing). It's just a more collective idea of caring for the community of kids in a given community. Plus, it works for the mums and babies :)

granolamom

November 5, 2010 - 3:25pm

I'm with you new_mamma
unless it is a case of emergency, I don't want another woman bf my baby.
an 'owie' can be dealt with in other ways too. If I was heading into surgery or something I would ask my sister or other close friend to bf for the short term, but not so that I could finish cooking dinner. honestly, I'm too selfish for that. I'd rather either let dinner burn, let someone else take over at the stove, let baby fuss a moment, than allow someone else to enter into my bf relationship with my baby.
but that's me (and obviously I am not alone). that others feel and behave differently does not surprise me, it only reinforces my belief that bf another woman's baby should not be done without the mama's permission.

new_mamma

November 5, 2010 - 8:39pm

I am thinking more of what happened with me the other day. Here is the situation-
I am sitting in the rocker at my friends house and she is sitting in a chair not six feet from me. Her 11 mth old son is crawling about (he is almost weaned) while I read a mag and she holds my baby. Suddenly I look up and she literally has her boob out of her top and three inches from my sons nose. She askes me if its ok just as she is about to let him latch! I barely had seconds to stop her! Why should I say yes? He was content and I am in the room with lots of milk for him. She only wanted to breastfeed him because she misses breastfeeding her son who she decided to wean early because he wanted to bite her nipples. How do I know she isn't HIV positive? I am talking about situations like this...

PS I agree with you 100% Aza...

aza

November 5, 2010 - 9:38pm

No way would I, nor many of the women i know, be comfortable with that, new_mamma! that just seems so unconscious and convoluted and a heck of a lot more about what the woman wanted than the needs of the baby.
You and gmom sound like such awesome tigress mamas!

christinabf

November 5, 2010 - 9:38pm

I would never want another woman to nurse my baby unless I was unable to due to hospitalization or something like that. I think that new_mamma's story is shocking - how could someone just offer their breast to a calm baby without asking the mother, who is even in the room with her? Pretty shocking. I would be particularly upset because I have so much milk (it sprays my daughter in the face when I open my bra!) that it would be totally unnecessary for someone else to do it for me.

I offered to pump milk once when a male friend came over with his baby one morning while his wife was at work. He had forgotten the baby's bottle of pumped milk. However, my daughter was already at least a year old at the time, and I had pretty much resumed eating whatever I wanted to (legumes, spicy foods, etc) and it occurred to me that a 2-month old baby might not react well to the chick pea curry I had eaten the night before! My friend seemed open to the idea, but I'm not sure if his wife would have been too thrilled with it, even though she was totally anti-formula and pumped religiously while working 60 hours a week.

One of my sisters pumped her milk for another one of my sisters when she was in the hospital for emergency surgery when her son was 5 weeks old. I know that it was greatly appreciated. I would happily pump my milk for someone else, or nurse their baby if they needed me to, but only if they asked me to. I wish I could give some of my milk to a formula-feeding mom!

louiseds

November 6, 2010 - 7:06am

I think we are reaching consensus that it is all about honesty, whose needs are being met, not making assumptions and negotiating situations as they arise.

There are so many opportunities for betraying trust by acting inappropriately in societies where the 'rights' of an individual can so easily be infringed. Trust lost can destroy relationships, and is very hard to rebuild.

I often think we shouldn't take ourselves quite so seriously, when, in practice, and with commonsense about disease prevention, there is very little real harm done with cross-suckling, and potential for a lot of good in some situations. We have seen that there are situations where it can work beautifully and build relationships and enrich communities and families. Goodness me, all parents share a lot more bodily fluids than breastmilk over a lifetime, and often with more than one partner!

We do live in litigious times, whether we like it or not, and besides that, we owe it to our family, friends and all children to act ethically and thoughtfully every time.

Keep discussing it, here and elsewhere. The more we discuss these things, the less opportunity there is for getting it wrong.

Louise

alemama

November 7, 2010 - 6:27pm

The article is called outsourcing breast milk.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1612710,00.html

wowza! 4K a month- 48K a year! I love that there is such value given to breast feeding by this organization.

I'm sure it's not surprise I would consider this a great job!
When I was eating for my baby's allergies we used to joke that my milk was priceless- what someone with a child with severe allergies would pay for a nourishing, organic, completely allergy free, local food that gave the child all he needed and tasted delicious.
on the same vein but off topic a bit- I know a woman who was solely breast feeding her 5 year old because of his severe allergies. Thankfully our baby has outgrown most of his already.

louiseds

November 8, 2010 - 2:18am

Doesn't that infringe some sort of protocol about not selling body fluids and body parts? eg, can you sell your blood, or does it have to be donated? What about paying a wet nurse? Is that the same?

ps I haven't read the article yet. Just wondering.

alemama

November 8, 2010 - 7:22am

well you can sell it here in the US

I know many college students who made good income selling plasma....
the article is about paying a wet nurse :)

granolamom

November 8, 2010 - 12:21pm

people sell sperm and eggs too

louiseds

November 9, 2010 - 5:04am

Hi Alemama and Gmom

I don't think we are allowed to sell any bits of body in Australia. I think it is all by donation, but I think you might be able to recover costs. Could be wrong though. I never really thought about it much.

aza

November 9, 2010 - 5:06am

Sure we are, louise. These eggs of mine would go for a pretty penny for sure!

louiseds

November 9, 2010 - 7:25am

How would you go about selling them? And how much would you get for them?

aza

November 9, 2010 - 3:36pm

Nah, not really something I'd do, personally. I have an acquaintance who has done it and it is such a huge process logistically, hormonally, etc. and for me the bigger picture of it all is a bit much...so many angles and considerations. Mostly though, I would never let anyone with a sharp thing near my bits!!!

granolamom

November 9, 2010 - 6:40pm

I believe the going rate here is in the $7000 range for ovum donation. read that somewhere, but cant swear to it.
not sure how many they take at a time though

aza

November 10, 2010 - 12:17am

You might be right, Louise. I just found this "Altruistic donors receive no financial gain as Australian legislation prevents payment for any human tissues. All routine out-of-pocket expenses for an anonymous oocyte donor are reimbursed by the recipient of the oocytes." Though there are nebulous phrases such as compensation for expenses and time are ok, so who knows what grey areas there are.
And it seems that surrogacy just became legal here this year?! Wow.

louiseds

November 10, 2010 - 6:53am

I did see another article talking about the surrogate parents falsely using the Medicare number of the couple receiving the baby, ie there are presumably Medicare records recording the birth of the baby, except the woman who gave birth is not the woman who gave birth at all, and there are false records created for the genetic maternity and paternity of the child. Perhaps not so transparent for the child, in future!

That's apart from the fraud involved in using somebody else's Medicare card and identity. My guess is that there is a whole heap of stuff going on underground and payments being made unofficially.

The blood products and organ donation stuff seems to work just fine by donation only, with good screening and looking after donors well, but once you start to get into assisted reproduction it all gets a bit shady.

Goodness me, in Australia, you even get a free cup of tea and a sandwich if you donate blood!

Christine

July 9, 2016 - 2:44pm

We've had many women vaginally birth with prolapse after finding WW, including Granolamom and Alemama. In searching that topic for Always Hopeful I ran into this amazing thread!

I love all you thoughtful WWomen so much!

Christine

chickaboom

July 10, 2016 - 9:48am

I've nursed my sister's kids and she mine. I don't breastfeed other babies without permission even though I've often wanted to - just an instinctive response to try to quiet and comfort them! Under Islamic law, 5 or more "filling" nursing sessions (some opinions are that only 3 sessions are required) for a baby 2 or under makes them your foster child, which comes along with its own set of laws. It would be interesting to learn about the physiological effect of foreign breastmilk on the baby.

Christine

July 10, 2016 - 12:31pm

Thanks for this, Chicka...I always love your contributions. Hope all is well!