Painful prolapse

I understand how you feel. Next month in March will be the the mark of a year after my bladder surgery. My colon is prolapsed now and I feel my uterus doing the same thing. I saw a new Ob about my situation and I said no to more surgery's. I agreed to use a pessary and continue doing the whole women poster and exercises.

Hello and welcome, Just a question,

I am sorry you are having such difficulty. Yes, the prolapse must be reduced, but whether this will be possible without surgery, I do not know. A pessary might be an option, as some post-hysterectomy women do find them suitable for the long-term.

The Whole Woman postural system works by pulling the uterus forward and into its anatomical position in the lower belly. In the post-hysterectomy woman, because her back vaginal wall is still connected to her intestines, I believe it is possible to stabilize prolapse by learning to hold her abdominal contents forward in the same way we do. This is providing her vaginal walls are long enough to fold down against intraabdominal pressure. A woman who has had hysterectomy and A&P repair is likely to have a very shallow, concave vagina. Because it cannot flatten against internal pressure, it is at risk of turning inside out. In this case, the top of her vagina must be connected to her spine by way of a mesh bridge. There are many ways hysterectomy is performed and all post-hysterectomy women are somewhere along this continuum.

I think it is reasonable for post-hysterectomy women to try this postural work to see if it can make enough of a difference in their symptoms. First of all, it’s necessary to understand that the pelvic outlet is at the back of your body, not underneath you. We hold the organs at the front of the body, so they cannot prolapse out the back. It is your intestines that are pushing the top of your vagina toward the back. If you learn to tip your whole belly forward and away from the pelvic outlet, it is possible your prolapse can be stabilized as well.

The post-hysterectomy woman’s lower spine is subject to unnatural forces due to loss of the inherent traction of the uterus. I caution any woman trying this work to take it slowly and be especially mindful of her lower back.

Wishing you well,

Christine

So sorry you are in pain. If the pain is 'topical' from dryness and rubbing how about using some kind of lubrication? Have you tried that yet? Maybe something like coconut oil. Also, can you get the prolapse to go back inside your body? Like if you do inverted poses like downward dog or knees and elbows? Finding out how mobile your prolapse is can be good information for you. Do you get relief when you lie down with your feet up?
I think I might try something like a sponge or pessary to try to hold the tissues inside the vagina.
I hope the pain goes away soon!

Hi Just A Question :-)
I have had dryness problems internally and also from rubbing similar to what you say but have not had a hysterectomy.We may be of similar age...
We use to be able to buy something called Bliss Balm here from Christine at Wholewoman, of which I purchased 1 pot and then it was discontinued.Then in desperation I made my own, from ideas here & looking at Christine's red clover balm tutorial and some posts from Alemama and others.I haven't looked back!
Before using Bliss Balm I was trying a natural product found here in NZ called Sylk- a natural personal lubricant, it says on the front of the small bottle I have .Its a light liquid, and was the best I could find here . I have also tried several non natural products and I can feel a sensation that to me means my body rejects it.So the natural ones like Sylk and Bliss Balm and the one I make myself feel far better ie like normal. Sorry to be long winded but I would have liked to have known this info quite a few years back when I was in distress too.Now the one I make, although its a bit greasy and does stain some materials(perhaps use a very light panty liner) is far more comfortable. So it's my version of Bliss Balm and easy to make on the stove in an average pot.Look at the tutorial of Christine's I mention above first so you get the idea.And it took me awhile to think I could make my own lubricant! I'm a city girl!
Ingredients are:-
a base of coconut oil-400gms ( Organic from health shop)I used 400gms
, then Olive oil-225gms (what I buy for cooking,usually extra virgin, I pour into jug and weigh on my scales)
, then beeswax-50gms (I happened to have bought some natural beeswax to be used as candles while on holiday here and travelling past a honey bee place, if not local for you then try google and buy online)
Because I only make a small batch I had to do my own calculation of amounts.The amount fills the original Bliss Balm pot medium size, plus 3 small pots/jars I have.I wash and sterilise them once while the mix is on the stove.You can trial and error for yourself as I have only made 2 batches and the amounts changed .ie I adapt the quantities to suit what I have available and eg the beeswax is the hardest for me to get.
I heat all together in my pot,over low heat untill melted, then take off and add some essential oil, I don't want too much so I use about 5 drops of Rose oil,or you could use lavender essential oil or rose geranium.Then pour into sterilised jars. This mix sets ,once cold ,although it fluctuates with the weather and can be quite runny in warm weather. keep it in the fridge maybe.I use a small fingernails worth am and pm and insert in like a tampon,as far up as possible but gently. I hope you are ok with this, its just one of the things we have to get use to with prolapse :-).I usually lean forward as that helps.And as far as falling out , I dont know how it feels with hysterectomy sorry, but If I do the hands and knees position like mentioned it helps, or bend forward knees bent , bottom out, forearms ressting on thighs . I can then feel everything slip back into place. Of course, sometimes, I have to keep doing that but at least i feel I have some control over it. The Wholewoman exercise will help with this posture and placement.I am still working on posture but I now find I do walk more chest out shoulders back and square and abdomen lifted. I think its starting to work for me now :-) I feel mainly in control for now.I hope this helps you in some way.All the best to resolving and working with your POP.
Anyone more qualified please correct me if I've said anything I should not have.With thanks for the wonderful support here.

Yes, there is really no such thing as a “bladder suspension” or "bladder sling", and a great peeve of mine that surgeons call it that. There are bladder neck slings, sub-urethral slings, and a wall of mesh placed in-between bladder and front vaginal wall.

I was referring to a sacrocolpopexy, when a strip of polypropylene is placed from the top of the vagina to the spine. Your instincts are probably accurate that it is your vaginal vault, or top, coming down to the vaginal opening, as happens often after hysterectomy.

Hips are a whole story in themselves and one I am putting into my new dvd. Female hips and lumbar spine work synergistically and when one is permanently changed, the other must compensate. A flattened lumbar spine rides differently on the femur than a curved one, placing different stresses on the hip joints. These are the profound and permanent changes hysterectomy brings, data on which is to be found nowhere in the scientific literature. However, I am finding enough information in the orthopedic literature to eventually be able to describe the condition accurately. I think a low belt - worn lower in front and higher in back to compress your hip joints - may counteract some of the negative forces. Remember, I am only talking in general terms and have no way of knowing what your particular condition might be. It matters in a woman who is decades post-hysterectomy, as these skeletal changes are set in stone.

Speaking of stone...

I woke up in the middle of the night thinking (probably a little more obscurely)...Have you ever seen those “jade eggs” they sell for strengthening the pelvic floor? We may have had a discussion or two about them here. Basically, I think weighting the vagina is not a useful concept for wombed women.

However, one of these “eggs”, which come in different sizes (just google ‘jade eggs’), if placed high in the post-hyst vagina, might take the place of a cervix weighting the vagina toward the front. The abdominal organs might then rest differently upon it - flattening it into place instead of pushing it out of the body. It is probably a crazy notion, but I think we have to consider every possibility.

That’s all from me for a couple of days, as I have to concentrate on my project.

Hugs from Christine

Hi just a question

I really feel for you with your discomfort and worry.

It might be worth trying olive oil. My skin reacts badly to most things and I'm a generally alllergic person, inside and out. However, when I went through a brief period of using sea sponges I tried a little (a very little) olive oil because I have no problems eating it. It was wonderful. I think we're only encouraged to use parmaceutrical products because lots of natural lubricants can compromise barrier contraception, but if that's not an issue at least you can guarantee that extra vigin olive oil is free of all nasties. It made sex wonderful too - but I kept it as my little secret.

Might be worth a try.

Doubtful

1 Sylk is made from kiwifruit (aka Chinese gooseberries).

2 When putting anything in your vagina, especially if peri/menopausal, please remember to cut your fingernails. Yes, I found this out the hard way. You could also use a finger from a rubber glove, or a condom, as a sheath.

3 You can buy beeswax from a hardware store. It is the main ingredient in home made furniture polish. It might have a few bees legs in it but if it is pure beeswax, it is pure beeswax. Look carefully at the ingredients label (and scoop out the bees' legs).

One of the difficult things about keeping bees is that they are sensitive to so many chemicals. In my opinion, if it is good enough for bees, it is good enough for me.

Other people may be a little more cautious than I am.

Louise

Hi again, thanks for that extra note, I have short fingernails now ;-)
I have been away for a few days and by chance was near the place I got my beeswax candles and they had little mounds of beeswax, yippee! So I bought 7. Just the right size for my use.Nice and clean looking too.
Just a question-I don't think of my homemade bliss balm as just a lubricant ,as I feel it does more than that.And I put up with the greasiness etc for the comfort it gives me.I have just been away and used mini g string liners in my soft bikini style pants. I bought them here at Cotton on for $5. Lots of pretty colours -btw they are not cotton but a very soft type of nylon or something like that, and have a cotton gusset.And with sitting long hours on a bike they breathe better than some cotton ones I have.
Louise-I'm thinking this post belongs somewhere else as well as sort of here......I do find it hard when I post to keep on track and know where I should be....as who will find this info if they want it.....:-(
Christine-Im looking forward to the new Yoga DVD and want to order it.So I best be on here daily from now on watching for it , thanks for everything. I have just been away with 2 other women ,(we span 3 generations). We had a chat about about POP.Hence WW posture being demonstrated.We learnt things from each other :-) . Spreading the word , YAY!

Hi Kiwigirl

I wouldn't worry too much about whether or not it is the right Forum. Conversations move from topic to topic anyway. If you want women to find your posts, then make sure you use lots of words that women are likely to put in their searches. Put in synonyms too.

I find Bliss Balm wonderful too, and wish it was still available. Thanks for posting your formula. Consistency walks a fine line during the summer months, between being too liquid and going everywhere, vs being too solid to spread easily. However, I think the coconut oil is the key to this, because it melts so quickly when applied to warm skin, so pulling of skin is minimised.

The main problem where I live is that during January and February the air is frequently near body temperature, so it is always runny!

Louise

I had a hysterectomy 3 years ago. No problems until a couple of months ago. I had burning raw pain until my gyny prescibed estrogen cream and estrogen suppositories to strengthen my inner and outer tissues. Many other lubricants irritated rather than helped. Within 3 days the burning is less. Doing the beginning DVD exercises daily with fire breathing and WW posture has lessened the pressure. My gyny feels after a month of treatment I might be able to be fitted with a pessary. If this works, I probably will be using this vaginal cream, less often, but regualrly. I learned this after going for a fitting for a pessary and finding out I was too sore to fit one. I'll keep posting my progress.

I wonder if a red clover cream would work?

KMScott, I am so pleased that oestrogen cream has given you some relief and that you can see that it is going to make the pessary fitting possibil. I am not trying to put you off oestrogen cream. You are just as capable as any of us of making your decision about what you use. I am just floating other possibiliies, as I am not an oestrogen cream fan.

Another alternative might be Replens, though it sounds like you have a lot of inflammation there. Once the pessary is sized correctly and in place, you might be able to use something gentler until it has to be removed again.

Louise