Baby Lifting and Wearing

Hey there, I'm also from NZ and you comment about your disbelief leaving no room for anger really resonates with me! A friend if mine who's just discovered she as a cystocele post natural childbirth said a GP told her 1/3 of NZ women who have a vaginal birth will develop a prolapse, yet nowhere in any prenatal classes or books about pregnancy and birth published here is there even a mention of the 'p' word. The level of deception is gutting, and then the causal suggestion that a little operation once you've finished having kids will fix everything up, no big deal, is so insulting to our intelligence!

Ok, got that out of the way! So I am 33, have a 2 year old and twins on the way (still trying to come to terms with that, really just wanted 1 more!). I developed a rectocele after the birth of my son, 2 1/2 hours pushing on command on my back, finished up with an episiotomy, and then 2 weeks pp found there's something not right and luckily found this forum, got the book and some of the DVDs. Of course by spending years sucking and tucking I had set myself up for developing a prolapse, but it was definitely the birth and pp lack of care that precipitated it.

The posture has really reduced my symptoms and again and again I have found that if I stick with it when baby wearing and lifting it keeps the bulge at bay. I found it easier to stay in posture when baby wearing than lifting though. I think it's inevitable that when looking after toddlers we're going to find ourselves in non WW posture positions (think trying to get your toddler into their car seat when they're not feeling cooperative, contorting yourself into some horrible position to catch them mid head dive off the sofa etc etc) but the key is just to stay in the posture as much as possible and take every opportunity to lift mindfully. The more you stick with the posture the less impact those straining situations will have on your prolapse, and when they do make you feel worse you will at least have built up confidence in being able to recover. For best case scenario lifting (I am reducing any toddler lifting as much a possible as the bump gets bigger), I bend my knees into a semi squat, then bend forward from the hips to maintain my lumbar curve, grip him under the arms and sort of draw him towards me and up my body to my chest so I can get one arm under his bum and one round his back, and then straighten up using my legs. Don't know if that's a clear enough description? Good luck with the WW work, I think you have found the best possible way to manage your situation :)

Great post, thanks. I agree that lifting the babe is often going to be problematic, but when you get back into posture, you should be OK. If you are holding the baby in good WW posture, close to your body, then the extra weight-loading from above actually accentuates the dynamics of pelvic organ support by helping to keep the vagina as a closed, airless space. I have found this to be true with lots of types of loads that I carry. Guard lumbar curvature as much as possible during the lifting part, then balance the load close to the body and accentuate your posture and you will hopefully feel what I mean. - Surviving

Thank you for this thread about lifting toddlers! That was going to be one of my questions! I am new here and do not have any of the tapes yet. We are transitioning right now and I do not have the budget for them right now.:( I have watched the video though and I think that I have the posture down while standing, it is just the sitting and lifting that I am a bit confused on. This post helped with the lifting my daughter is almost 16 months and so I try not to lift her as much as possible, but then there are the groceries, plus her, and the laundry and well there is a lot of lifting and sitting...how do we do that? Is it possible in normal chairs? Maybe I should give some background, first! Sorry, I'm a bit of a stream of consciousness person and just trying to write quickly while she is napping!:)
I did have a natural birth at home with her, but I did push before I was ready for 3 1/2 hours, encouraged to, but not on command, because I had been in labor for 24 hours and was losing strength, I had her standing up on the birth stool, but suffered a 3rd degree tear. We discovered my cystolcele after the 6 wk follow up and while it was between a 2-3 and now is probably at a 2, maybe a little less...I just feel discouraged that it has not gone back. I was seeing a pelvic floor husical therapist that was wanting me to elevate my pelvis twice a day for 10 minutes and practice deep breathing, all good, except I have my daughter and it is difficult to say the least to do that. I discovered this site last week and I do think that I can feel a difference already from practicing that poster, but I do want the DVDs for the workout and I am interested in fire breathing too....anyways, I do not feel like my prolapse bothers me during sex anymore and peeing is ok, I usually get up at night and I canNOT hold it, but other than that...I just want to not have it get worse and I am concerned about the weight of another pregnancy we aren't planning one soon, especially since we recently miscarried at 7 weeks, and the whole pregnancy was a surprise, but then so was the loss, we lost 5 babies before Joanna, but I think I felt in the clear since we made it all the way to 41 weeks with her...do any of y'all think the prolapse contributed to the loss? That may be too loaded of a question, but thank you for reading and for any advice you can give about sitting, etc. I am definitely gonna try the lifting, so the goal is to maintain the lumbar curve and keep loads close to the body, correct?
Thanks!

Hi LilyGrace and welcome. The good thing about learning and understanding the posture principle is that you can apply it to everything that you do, and the best ways of doing things will become self-evident to you. Yes, protecting lumbar curvature is the key. Lifting is kind of a necessary evil.....we have to do it from time to time, and it won't always be easy. But once you have lifted something, if you are back in excellent posture the extra weight held close to the body can actually accentuate the good dynamics. Sitting posture is just like standing posture....you want to sit forward with lumbar curve in place, you don't want to collapse your spine into the soft back of the chair. Obviously not all chairs are conducive to this.

Throwing yourself into this work is what enables you to lose the fear of things getting worse. That to me was the scariest thing about the initial discovery of prolapse. I've been here 4 years and I can tell you that the organs haven't stopped moving around, they're not always where I want them, but I have a great degree of control over them, and absolutely NO fear about the future of my prolapse.

I'm so sorry to hear of all the failed pregnancies and hope that your prolapse will not deter you from continuing to try. I think I can say with certainty that a cystocele did not cause the loss. In the grand scheme of things, it's really quite a minor problem, though it never seems that way when we are first learning how to manage it.

You have made a great start. Keep those organs forward! Do try to get the First Aid for Prolapse dvd if you can. It has so much info and a great demonstration of firebreathing, which is the best tool in the toolbox. - Surviving

Thank you, Surviving60, SOOO much for your kind response!
Yes, the fear of it getting worse I think is more difficult at times than the actual prolapse, so I am very excited to feel empowered with the posture and for it to become more of a way of life for me. It does feel strange of course right now as I too have years of being told to suck in my tummy and tuck my butt under, but I do feel better when in the posture and it feels good to have something that I can do all day, instead of just the elevating that I cannot always fit in the time to do...
Speaking of which, do you think the elevating is a waste of time?
I would much prefer to try to live in the posture and eventually do the workouts, etc...
I am also thankful to know that when in WW posture weight actually helps the good dynamics! My husband and I love to backpack and I was feeling discouraged that that was out of the question for me now.
Thank you too for the recommendation of the First Aid DVD, I will be trying to figure out how to get that soon and am glad to know it contains fire breathing technique too.

Truly, I felt my spirit lift when I read your response, like ok, I can deal with this, I will have to live more consciously in this area, but I do in other areas of life and know the benefits that I have gained, so I feel empowered by your testimony of NO fear and great control (how I desire both!!) and more resolved in my initial belief that this was the right approach for me, so I actually feel excited in a way!! Thank you that is a gift! Especially after feeling guilty for over a year now that I have been doing something wrong or was just not committed enough...when I actually did not have all the information!! Anyways, I know I sound gushy, but thank you! I'm truly grateful!

Thank you for your sympathy for our losses. While each is truly painful, especially after been blessed with our precious daughter, I desire the full number of little souls that The Lord chooses to bless us with, so stoping trying, for me would just be more painful. She is such an amazing little person! I am amazed by the creation of new life! Also, she is a great reminder, she maintains the WW posture perfectly ALL THE TIME!! I have actually been studying her and trying to imitate her movements and it is fascinating how different and more natural they are than mine!

I agree, ActiveandLapsed, I would love for all of us early years pp to share and learn...that would be super helpful and a blessing! What carrier do you have for your back? Other then a backpacking backpack, and a couple of times in the boba, I have rarely had her on my back...she does not seem to like it as much, I think because she can't see as well, not sure...what are your thoughts?

And yes, would love to hear from Surviving about the hip carry in WW posture, cause that is her preferred place when I do carry her.

Thank you ladies for your support!

Hi ActiveandLapsed. i don't have strong feelings about sea sponges one way or the other. Haven't seen too many members on here who had great luck with them. When you are new to this work, getting rid of the bulgy feeling seems like the top priority, but it isn't really. If you find something that pushes the bulge up and forward temporarily, then naturally you feel like you're doing something positive and thus keeping things from worsening. But you aren't really, and it's better to learn how to move the organs forward through correcting the posture. Once you start doing this, the bulge itself is not to be feared; rather it is a great barometer of what works and what doesn't. For now, I'd say go ahead and wear it if you are planning to be very active and think that the extra support will help you get through something. Most certainly this is better than a pessary which is sometimes left in for long periods. As you get farther along with WW work you will feel confident without it.

If you can stay in good posture, I think that carrying the babe on the hip should be fine. It tends to throw you a bit off-center, but then, life is like that! Baby-carrying is such a fleeting time in our lives - do it as much as you can while you still can! You sound like you have a good enough understanding of this work to let your body and your symptoms be your guiide. Keep up the good work - Surviving

Christine taught me early on, that the important work of prolapse management is done when we are on our feet, with the forces of gravity working in conjunction with our breathing and the weight of the organs themselves. That's why sleeping and resting positions don't matter much. We all get prolapse relief when we are lying down, after all. Elevating the pelvis doesn't move our organs where they ought to be anyway. Better to get down on hands and knees, so that the organs are positioned where they belong in the belly, and do some firebreathing while you're there. The idea of elevating the pelvis sounds like just another product of a medical establishment which doesn't really understand anatomy and continues to portray the "pelvic floor" as a basket of organs with a hole at the bottom! So you elevate the pelvis for awhile, and then what? You stand back up, and nothing has changed. Learning correct posture and spinal shape is what brings a change.

I absolutely love that you have recognized the natural posture in your little girl. Our kids are living proof that this how we were meant to stand and move. I carry this image in my mind (in fact I even carry a picture with me, in case I'm ever talking posture with someone and I need a visual to prove that THIS IS HOW WE WERE MADE)....

And by the way, a couple summers ago when i was well into the WW work, I hiked for about 3 hours straight in excellent WW posture. When it was over, I couldn't even feel my 'celes. So yet another lightbulb turned on in my brain that day!

Glad you are here, you have the right attitude to do great with this. - Surviving

Thank you Active for your empathy...and interesting that you asked that...
The night before I read your post, I had gotten down on all four after my shower and really tried some deep breathing to the best of my knowledge since I don't have any books or DVDs yet and then the next day I had a pretty sad day...it has felt hard to really grieve and be present to the loss the way I know I need to while chasing around and mothering my darling girl the way she needs...and then I read your post and I thought, hmmm, maybe this is helping me be present where I need to be to heal??
So, yes, maybe I do think so...how fascinating...and thinking about healing and restoring peace when I breathe deeply, so I think it can only help me heal...oxygen is good, and sending my breath down deep has SOOO many I other benefits that I'm sure it will encourage restoration here too...I will let you know if anything else comes up:)...also about your dryness, that is truly amazing! Thank you for sharing that!

I am wondering how to sneeze?! I know it sounds silly, but my allergies have been acting up lately and I'm trying to find a comfortable position to sneeze in that does not cause incontinence...any suggestions??

Also, I feel since I have started practicing the posture as much as possible I am feeling more pressure at times...I'm not sure if I'm just really noticing when I get out of the posture more(I noticed that I tighten when stressed or busy too, Active:(), or if my deep breathing is causing me to bulge some or if I'm doing something wrong...anybody else experienced this? It could just be my learning curve...

I do feel better when carrying her more though as well as other things, so that has given some confidence...I know it will take awhile to really get used to the posture.

Thank you Surviving60, yes that was what was SOOO discouraging to me about elevating! It was explained to me that it was to counter what gravity was doing while I was on my feet, but I'm on my
feet almost all day and only supposed to elevate twice a day 20 minutes total??? It just did not add up for me and felt like a losing battle...

It is SOOO much more encouraging and makes SOOO much more sense that we would be designed to work with gravity!
I was truly encouraged by your testimony of your hike! CanNOT wait to share when I get that skilled at maintaining the posture!:)
Thanks for your compliment about my attitude:), focusing on trusting and learning one day at a time:)
Appreciate y'all!
LilyGrace

Dear LilyGrace,
Hi - click on https://wholewoman.com/forum/node/4640 - I had the same Q & was given some ideas to try. I put the word sneezing in the search box to find it.
Hope this helps.

Best wishes,
Aussie Soul Sister

When I lift my 20-month-old I squat, keeping my lumbar curve in place as much as I can.But I have become a bit obsessed with squatting recently so don't recommend you launch into doing that all the time. I don't carry him on my hip much because it makes me feel all wonky, asymmetrical. I just hold him facing me with his legs around my sides. The higher up the better. He can still look around from this position.

Thank you Aussie for that link that was very helpful!!

Active, I had intended to express my sorrow for your loss as well as realized later that I I did not, please forgive me.:( I am saddened that you too have suffered and pray that your heart is healing as well...it is never easy.

I also wanted to thank you for mentioning the posture on the toilet for BMs...I am sorry that you are struggling with those, I had terrible hemroids and an anal fissure that did not heal for 8 months pp, once I figured out that I can't do any dairy(I had already cut out cow, but still did goat...turns out not recommended for my blood type anyways, but that's another story:), things finally healed. However, I had developed the habit of rocking over to one side while pooing...I caught myself doing it the other day and switched to the posture...it was SOOO much more comfortable and less precarious/awkward! Thanks!

So, I watched Destination:prolapse-free and the New Kegels again and figured out that I was trying to accentuate my lumbar curve without lifting my chest...once I corrected that things have gotten much better!!
My allergies have been severe these last two days, but I've had NO accidents! I have also been doing the new Kegels (are these also the same as fire breathing) in the shower on hands and knees each night and using someone's idea that I read in another post somewhere on here about fully emptying my bladder in this position and it has been super helpful!
I also figured out that the moby wrap will work in a hip hold and that I can carry her like that comfortably for awhile and feel sported in the posture...which is helpful when she is teething and clingy like now!!
Anyways, just wanted to update with that tip and to say that I think I'm starting to get it more and more!

Congratulations on using your good instincts to figure out your postural correction. This is the most common correction I make with women who thought they were in WW alignment. You can see that when you try to stick out your bum, you shift the weight onto your heels. This places the center of mass of your body over the front aspect of your hip, instead of distributing it over the whole of the joint, and causes stress to your sacroiliac joints. You can only properly rotate the pelvis all the way forward when you relax your abdominal wall and lift your chest.

So glad to hear you are also carrying your bubs on your hip while staying in the posture. Proud of you!

:-) Chrsitine

You are completely right LilyGrace - It's all in the breathing sequence, which is the same whether you are doing full-out firebreathing or just some gentle pelvic rocks (both of which are demonstrated in the New Kegels clip). You are totally getting this! - Surviving

Thank you, Christine! I truly appreciate hearing from you and for your comments and praise! A light bulb did come on when I lifted my chest and things have been MUCH better! I also noticed that I tend to actually hold my breath when tense, SOOO not helpful!
Anyways been focusing on that both lifting chest and breathing and relaxing with new Kegels at night and it has been SOOO helpful!
Of course not to a place yet where I can share a big story, but did go on a small hike on Monday at a good pace and stayed really focused on the posture and did NOT feel a thing!! Praise The Lord! It was beautiful!
Thank you for making this your glorious life's work and for support those of us who are new with such love and care...you have richly blessed me and changed the course of my life and my daughter's!
Much blessing to you both and all!

Dear All,
Wonderfully helpful string of posts. Not much to add just to say thank you for all those great q's and a's.

Just to add - if any of you have inspiring success stories. Please do post 'success stories', many of which appear in the forum file on the menu on the right hand side. For instance Active and Lapsed's post:
"Out of interest. I have suffered from dryness for about 10 years (since my mid 20s) and as soon as I got the breathing (I had it all backwards with my tight abs) the moisture came back. Remarkable really."
It's these sorts of testimonies and evidence that in the long run will not only be inspirational but form or help to initiate the evidence based outcomes and research that would help to get this work recognised and mainstream.

Love and best wishes, wholewomanuk