Feeling so sad :o(

I always "want" to read whatever is honestly in your mind. You have to let these feelings out and we are certainly an understanding population because we have been there. You say some things that raise a red flag to me. Our minds and bodies operate together as a whole. What affects one affects the other. A life changing physical disorder - and if "disorder" doesn't describe your pelvic organs with this condition I don't know what does! - will impact you emotionally and psychologically. Sometimes we can handle the emotional impact ourselves but sometimes we need a little extra help.

You say some things that indicate you should probably consult a counselor or psychologist.

* You think about this 24/7.
* You have anxiety so bad you physically shake and want to vomit.
* You cannot find pleasure from little things in life. (Your daughter smiles and you can't enjoy it.)
* You are becoming emotionally distant from your loved ones.

These are red flags that you are being impacted emotionally so much that you are in danger of some serious consequences. They have been continuing for quite a while now and you do not seem to be improving. It is normal to undergo anger, grief, etc., with this diagnosis, but you want to monitor it to make sure it doesn't spiral down into something damaging. In your case now I think it might. It is possible you are having an episode of genuine depression. Just because the POP is the cause doesn't mean depression isn't real. It would be evil for a doctor to tell you your POP is "all in your head" and to go to a "shrink" but it would be equally evil for someone to tell you that your problem is entirely in your pelvis and you shouldn't do anything to treat your mind.

For difficult and complicated problems I find the best approach is a multidimensional one. You can do things to treat your prolapse but you must also do things to treat the mind and heart. These symptoms I have listed are as real as the physical prolapse and need to be addressed. I think you should consult a psychologist and perhaps start some counseling. This won't do anything to improve your POP directly but it can do wonders to help you cope and to improve your quality of life, but most important to prevent the results of a downward spiral into depression.

Your description of yourself right now sounds very familiar. I was there once. I had a very bad reaction to surgery on my hand a few years ago that caused my right hand (and i am right handed) to be disabled, useless and in great pain 24/7. Looking into the future felt like looking into a dark, yawning abyss. I was so scared it made me physically unable to eat. But for several months I got no treatment. I was being told by the surgeon that I was merely taking "longer than normal to heal". I was so emotionally wrecked that I eventually got to the point of considering ending my own life. When I was finally properly diagnosed and began to get the treatment for my hand, I realized that I also needed to treat my mental state. I was severely depressed but I did not recognize it as such. I thought it was just a "reaction" to my hand. Well it WAS. But that didn't make it any less real.

I began a long, slow process to treat my hand, but also treated my mind. I consulted psychiatrists and had a thorough evaluation. The diagnosis was "situational depression" - that is - real depression caused by a specific event in time, (as opposed to primary depressive disorder). I was given medication and I got into counseling. Both helped tremendously. Anti-depressants are over- prescribed and I don't like taking them, but there are some circumstances they can help pull you out of quicksand and this was one of them. I was given sleeping medication because a full nights sleep is very important to fight a negative mental state. Again, I think sleeping pills are over-used and normally you should avoid them, but in an acute crisis if you simple can get no sleep at all they can be a lifesaver. My philosophy is to treat things naturally as much as possible but I don't discard modern pharmaceuticals across the board. I believe in using them very judiciously for particular circumstances. A severe, acute, circumstantial depression would be one of those times they could help you. You don't want to rely on them permanently but that is why you go through counseling; to gain better equilibrium and find ways to come to terms with what has happened to you.

I think it is at the point where you need to address these psychological symptoms directly. If someone has an illness that makes them bedridden and that causes bedsores, then the bedsores need to be directly treated. Bedsores are real and can kill you. Doesn't matter that the illness making you an invalid is the prime cause. Likewise your POP is causing mental symptoms which are real and can hurt you. Even if you don't consider suicide, your health is damaged by the very high levels of cortisol and other stress hormones that your body makes when in a state of anxiety. Seeing a counselor for your state of mind would be like treating the bedsore. If they suggest medication, use it but with the plan to move to more natural methods of managing anxiety and depression in the future. Self-hypnosis, yoga, oh there are many options, but I think it is very important to hit this immediately with some serious First-Aid until you can find better and more permanent solutions.

Hi Anita

So sorry you are still feeling really down. I had been waiting to hear some more positive posts from you, but they are not coming, are they?

Reading your other post and reading this one had me thinking exactly the same as Kit. This has gone on for too long Anita, and I too really think you need some professional help to get you moving past this pain in your heart and these awful thoughts that you have been having repeatedly. I identified the same list of bad signs as Kit.

Being the person having these thoughts you may not be able to see that there is a way out of this. Only somebody who has been there will recognise the bad space you are in and can relate to you that it is possible to get out of it, and back to a sense of having a normal life.

If you didn't have prolapse it probably wouldn't be happening, but as Kit says, that doesn't mean that the only way to get out of the horrible space is to get rid of the prolapses (which you can't do anyway). I have been there in that bad space too, though not via prolapses, and many years ago, and I have come through it as well. You can come through it too, but you will need to admit that you cannot do it by yourself and take the step of asking for some serious help, because nobody else can ask for you.

Please, please, for yourself, your husband and your family, ask for help to get yourself on your way to recovery. I know you can do it, and I think you need to do it.

All the best

Louise

ok, some tough love here

you may have been down this road before (depression I mean) and you say you know when to go to the dr. honey, I've been depressed too (real clinical depression I mean, not the down in the dumps type). I knew I was depressed and also thought I'd know when to get help. You are not necessarily able to make that distinction right now. do it even if you think you don't need to. I'm not saying take meds if you don't need them, but talk to a professional. whats the worst? a few sessions with a psychologist. and FORCE yourself to do those algorithms (I don't know what they are, but if you found them helpful before, do 'em). if you can't make yourself do that then that's a sign you need more help.

you don't have to describe depression related to stress or anxiety to me. I live with that every day. I've got it, my dd's got it. Its not an easy way to have to go through life. life is never stress free. well, maybe for a short time.
we (my dd and I) have found help with some cognitive behavioral therapy. I find I have to learn to deal with the stressors, not wait for it to go away, because the next stressful situation is always right around the corner. worrying about what's next can throw me into a depression too.
so its day by day for me. and that was not an easy skill to learn either. but it is a skill and you can learn it too.

and I completely agree with everything anne said earlier. your mind affects your body at least as much as the other way around.

and if this keeps up I may just have to find out where you live, come over and nag you until that fighter in you comes out to get rid of me.

I have only read the original post but just wanted to pipe up and say these have helped me a lot with any emotional stuff.. They are designed to be a simple system that you can self prescribe. There is lots of information if you google or let me know if you would like links....

The idea is you choose up to 6 or 7 to help balance out your emotions, so could pick some for the anger that you are feeling, some for the sadness, some for anxiety, fear and so on. You don't need to think about it too deeply, just see which you are drawn to.

If you havn't time to do it, then rescue remedy is a good one to have to hand for the times you are feeling worst, but it is more useful to tailor your own ime

hth Soup xxx

Hi,
I know that there is no cure for prolapses but there are other aids that can make it feel less like everthing is going to fall out. Go to the search box on the left and type in sea sponges, then pessary and you will find many posts about some of us who have tried various things. Some work for one person but not everyone but are worth a try.
I wear a pessary and it certainly has helped me. The sea sponges work very well for others. You don't have to wear them all the time.
I have used a pessary for about five years and don't feel it when it is in and I do a lot of walking, exercising etc.
When I first started to do the posture I had a grade three prolapse. With the posture it improved to a grade two and has stabilized there.
If you can assure yourself that things are not going to fall out it may help you to work on the other problems you have. It would be one less worry.
You are missing out on some of the best years of your little ones development. I know when my darlings were little,were some of the happiest times of my life. They are all grown now and left home several years ago but I still have the memories and when I am feeling down I pull some of those memories out and end up feeling much better.
I have learned thru the many years of living that the things we worry about the most do improve with time.
Don't hate your life rejoice and be happy with all the blessings you have.
Regards,
Flora.

your life will never be the same again. It will be better. Richer. You will live more fully than ever before. You will have a greater understanding of the pain and suffering of the world. You will relate to others in pain.
Why me? you ask. Because you are alive.
You say you can't help but to look to the future. Your future holds beautiful things. When I first found my prolapse one thing that helped me was to imagine the worst case scenario and sit with the idea for a while. In the end I decided the worst case scenario was not so bad.

You are allowed to have bad days. You are allowed to be sad. You are allowed to look at other women and men and hate them for not having POP. You are allowed to isolate yourself.

But then you must get up. You must grow. You must become a radical change agent educating all around you about the posture. You will not be motivated by fear. You will trust your body to get stronger.

Then only way to grow is to be cut down. Like pruning a plant. You will use this "chronic condition" and your experience with it and apply it to other difficult situations.

This will not own you.

Hi Anita

While you keep posting, we will keep throwing things back at you.

Now, my bit of tough love. You have one part of you telling you to do everything you can to enable yourself to heal. You have another part telling you that you are going to be miserable for ever. The one you listen to most is the one that is going to influence you the most. Only *you* can decide to tell the second one to butt out, because you have a life to live. Nobody else can make that decision for you. You have to do it. You are the only one who can choose.

Don't keep these unpleasant thought in your head. They feel safe there, protected from scrutiny. Bring them out in the open, expose them to the light. Give them a slap in the face, challenge them, tell them they are irrational and replace them with a rational thought that is true. Then kick them out of your life.

Re waiting until you can't get out of bed before you scream for help. That is a pretty selfish way to deal with it, waiting for a crisis to respond to the signal. It's like saying, "Help!" as you disappear under the water. It is much better to yell for help while you still have some strength to yell, and some strength to stay afloat. If you wait, others will have to rescue you from your complete helplessness, and that means your husband and family, and health professionals, when they are already dealing with their own challenges and fears, which will be a lot worse if you collapse completely.

Your body, mind and heart are all telling you that you need more help than you are getting. Why aren't you listening to them????? You are not doing justice to yourself or your family by continuing your suffering. You don't have to pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. You have been down this path before, and getting help has given you some relief and some hope and some healing in the past. When a person has been depressed they have to be on the lookout for a return of symptoms, because as sure as eggs is eggs, it will sneak up on you again and try and ruin your life all over again.

You are not your depression, but it is threatening to swallow you up and absorb all your brainpower. It is parasitising you. You are not yet ready to go into a box. You have so much to live for in your family who love you dearly and are no doubt worried as hell about you.

If you love them, get some help. If you don't, you are *all* likely to endure a whole heap more suffering, and I wouldn't wish that on anybody.

Sorry Anita, if you or anyone else thinks this is cruel. It just comes from the heart.

John 10:10. I came so that you could have life in all its fullness.

Louise

Hey A,
Me too - every last painful word. i can't seem to suck it up. i KNOW I am a burden. I can't focus on conversations that go on. i don't call my Gf's -they have to call me... But now that I let the answering machine intercept all my calls from the Mortgage company, I listen to my dear friends concerned or cheery voices... It's getting harder and harder to call back. And I wish I could be painlessly erased out of my friends and family's minds and hearts. They all deserve better. I wish I could start over again. All I seem to do is be aware of how much ability I have lost and how dependent and burdensome I have become. I have one more missed payment before foreclosing evaluation begins. I sit and make rag rugs or knit and try not to cry because it gets in the way and I don't want to burden anyone any further. I don't know what to do. I barely have any connection with my other family since my Mother's bizarre breakdown and verbal assault. She puts her anger towards others..me. I guess I just turn it in on myself. Only my brother calls - occasionally, and he has strong boundaries and will not triangulate on any level. I'm under such stress that my hair has been falling out at an alarming rate. The face that looks back at me from the mirror has changed so much. The energy around me so sad that when the service people in town tell me to have a nice day they put a little feeling in it. I don't want pity or even concern, I really wish I was a better actress, so I could go unnoticed.

I used to dance every day - in my kitchen, with my friends, my husband.
I used to hike for hours. My dog misses this.
Trying Cross-country skiing brought on this episode.
I used to wrassle/tickle my kids.
I used to vacuum while my mind wandered.
I used to be.

These are the most hopeless and frightening feelings I have ever experienced. No worries I would never hurt anyone by doing anything drastic. I just see myself withdrawing and getting smaller. My only hope is the knowledge that everything is cyclical. Even this. I do have days when I can be on my feet. And this - ? -
Is this what I have to look forward to ?
Am I going to be homeless and broken ? How many broken women ARE out there just that way ?
gloomy Zelda

Hey girl, you are still posting. Good on you! We have all been wondering how you are getting on. Praying for you. Just do some baby steps. Make sure you take a walk every day. Start today, even if it only to the next street corner. Don't push it too far at first. Be kind to yourself. Research shows that just a little walking every day will lift your spirits, kind of lift you to that next step where you can climb to the next one on that really steep staircase that looms above you.

It will all pass dear Zelda, but you will have to give it a little shove. You are very frightened now. Please get help to deal with all you have to deal with, and don't leave us.

Louise

I so wish I had time to respond to this right now. I've thought of you a hundred times and more! Please don't stray so far again. I need you to stay around for some reason...call me selfish, it's okay, but, till I figure it out, please try. I know so, so, so well that feeling of wanting pure aloneness though...I truly understand. But still, please don't do it. I'll got to run, but I'll be back. love, Kit

Seeing your name on here made my night!!

Zelda, I have been watching for you and wondering about you.

Last night my dh and I were eating bean soup and rice for supper, watching Dancing with the Stars, amidst fielding phone calls from our ds who needed his Dad's technical assistance. During a father/son phone call I clicked on the forum and found you here. I didn't have time to properly absorb your post right then, but your name leaped from the page and stayed with me. We finished our show late due to all the calls and then went to bed. A few minutes later...I call upon the Angels was the line that first caught my attention...I left the bed for the computer and wrote for you. Some of the lines...the soul of my own soul...the heartbeat of your heartache...oh, as someone who writes, I really, really wanted to protect and to be selfish and to keep those lines to myself for a while. But I know they are for you, and hopefully for others, as well. They have surely affected me.

Zelda, I am blessed to have found you and so many others on this path that I am on. I, too, claimed aloneness for awhile. This place kept me from going to deeply there. The physical trials are hard, hard, hard, but the lessons they teach, the understandings they bring are so deeply powerful. Still, I find myself saying ‘please, please don’t require too much more of me.’ ‘I understand now, I truly do.’ Uncle, Uncle, I say!!! Stay strong, dear Zelda. Your light will come home. It is far too powerful to do otherwise.

As you read these words, know that I am with you, and with anyone else that's hurting. Kit

For you...

What is this thing, this connection that I feel?
It has no form or breath or touch,
But I know that it is real.
I close my eyes and see a pure bright Light
Across a darkened sky,
And from the soul of my own soul
I know not to question, why.
I do not know you, but then I do.
I cannot see you, but still I see.
I feel the heartbeat of your heartache
As if you were here with me.
You are a precious Child of Light,
It’s waiting there for you,
But you are caught between
What you want- and what you know is true.
Somehow you must surrender,
To accept imperfect things,
Then the Light will find its way back home
And with it wholeness bring.
I call upon the Angels,
On Good Spirits everywhere,
To summon all that is good
To counter your despair.
What is this power that I feel?
Who writes upon this page?
Do these words come from the strength in me,
Or from the part that knows Afraid?
Or do they just come through me,
For they know I’ll understand?
Is the Light that shines in darkness
Lending me a hand?
What is this thing, this connection that I feel?
It has no form or breath or touch,
But it is just as real.
I call upon the Angels,
On Good Spirits everywhere,
To wrap their care around you,
To free you from despair.
I do not claim these words as mine
But this I know is true--
Just as the Light shines in the darkened sky,
These words came for you.

12PM 11/27/2007
Love, Kit

Honestly Kit, dearest-of-heart,
You are part of what makes this all seem like there MUST be some grander scheme. Some orchestrated mission to teach me
things new to my heart.

I will tell you I had wave after wave of goose-bumps upon reading your poem. There was another poem of yours that was dedicated
to all of us that was also surgical in it's path to the heart of who all of us broken women are. You are a word mage. I'm not sure if it was
you or ATS - the two of you blur together at times, I'm sorry to admit. I wish I had faces to add to my knowledge of you both. One of you
spoke of your belief that all of us have some higher calling or worth that we have to contribute back to us All. It was directed towards
Christine for her incredible vision and gift to us All that this forum IS, and how she surely found her life's mission.

You- my dear, have a gift that I'm glad you share, you are less encumbered by the filters that exist between head and heart than most
of us. You have a gentleness that becomes a hug - all delivered thru words. Well done. I feel like I am lucky to be witnessed by You and
your tenderness. I'm glad that I've inspired You. It balances all the burdening I do.

We are broken in body and yet our spirits are making up for our physical weakness. Like the blind listening to music.... So are these bitter
lessons all the more valuable from the earning ? I'm not sure which wise woman spoke of the compassion we are learning through these
trials, these words have "sparked" in my darkest corners. Is this suffering and physical limitation forcing us to cultivate other aspects of our hugely
dynamic souls ? I keep thinking about how I have encouraged my children to throw away their broken toys... I feel as though my value is
gone and should also be thrown away, but somehow know it's not so. Where does this conditional "value" come from I wonder?

I admit your writing often inspires deep reflection for me.
I'm grateful for the time you spend writing. I love to write but feel it's stolen time, so I appreciate your (stolen) time in the writing.
Please don't worry about my silences. I am in such survival mode that I only occasionally come up for air... Work=$$, ya know.

I imagine/hope if I can stabalize my life I will have more to give. As I do so enjoy responding and have come to care as much for you
as for other dear friends and witnesses to the joys and pains in my life. I wouldn't call myself a christian or anyother religion - but I Do see,
we are far more what we give, than what we take. Thank You for reminding me of this so Essential truth.
Right now I'm pretty focused on my own ass and am ashamed of the accompanying selfishness.
Thank you for helping to make this endurable.
With such long-winded affection,
Zelda

Dear Zelda that you, on the hardest of days that may come, I hope that you will come back to the words that you just wrote to me and that you will read them and truly see yourself in them. There is a specialness about you that I cannot describe. You reach me so deeply. I am honored that I was chosen to receive your inspiration and perhaps place a small healing touch on your life. In the early days, my writing would come with an intensity that sometimes took my breath away, it would just dissolve me. This one to you was like those early days. For it to reach me through distance and technology humbles me and awakens me anew. There is more for me to do. I will work through these physical trials, accept what is asked of me and offer back what feels right. I say these things to you because for whatever reason I trust you understand.

I cannot let my heart accept that you may lose your home. Home should be a sanctuary. You need that so much right now. Something has to work out for you and your family. I am so glad that you all have each other through this difficult time.

Thank you for what you have given me. Thank you for what you said to me. You have blessed me and touched me and made my heart full. Love, Kit