anatomy, mine that is

Submitted by babygotback on May 17, 2008 - 4:50pm
Body: 

Hey, I am new. I am a friend to alemama, who is working me over with her naula biz, very cool stuff. Just a bit of effort, though less successful that my trim and fit friend, gave me a pretty sore belly. (in a good way)

So, I am here reading your goodies and getting to know the flavor. I decided I would like to get some info if anyone is willing to share. I tried searching and just enjoyed fun conversation, but didn't get the answers I am looking for yet.

Here is the deal: I am trying to figure out why my anatomy is changing, what I can do about it, and what the goal is.

My outside is a little bulgy as a profile, as I see with a mirror, I see accordian tissue escaping the vaginal opening on anterior and posterior sides, the back side at an angle a bit. When I feel around (thank you FAM for the anatomy 101 or I would be lost) inside, I notice a half pipe anterior muscle type tissue up the front leading to the top, where my cervix lives, usually presenting from the front side at the depth depending on my cycle. The back side is soft, pillow-like tissue that feels unfolded and not muscular at all. If my bowel is full, I feel the contents here through the pillowy wall very easily, in fact, I can notice this feeling during love-making. It does not hurt, but I do notice a full bowel during love-making. I think back to pre-birth memories of my insides and don't remember loosness or the pipe thing and there were certainly no accordians hanging out. However, I do recall the accordian tissue present before kids, just it was less and tight. I don't remember much about that time period or what it felt like really, but I am sure things have changed. I remember post-birth feeling that some contents were present at the opening that didn't belong. It always felt I had a tampon slipping out until I got used to the sensation. Laying in bed helped, but was less practical with little ones running around. Also, of course, it was worse after BMs.

In the next year or so, I would like to have a baby again. I am fearful about the direction my body is taking me. My grandma had things "restrung" and still has troubles. I DON'T want to go there. She is so quiet about it all, and was such a trooper. I am too stubborn not to learn more and do something about this.

Okay, well, that was the most personal introduction I have ever given of myself and I think alemama knows a bit more about me than before-hehe.

Thanks for thoughts in advance. I do hope to learn if what I am feeling inside is healthy and what I can do about it.

babygotback (a random name that just popped into my head, but reminds me of the beautiful well-postured women friends I had in the south not long ago. I think they have got a good thing going there. :P )

louiseds

May 18, 2008 - 1:16am

Well, it all sounds pretty normal to me as one of the 50% of women with children who end up with prolapses. It is not the same as before babies. Though many women 'get their figures back' after babies, many do not, regardless of getting back to pre-pregnancy weight. They look pre-pregnancy on the outside, but often their insides are a bit saggy, and often their lycra undies and underwire bras hide a multitude of lumps and bumps.

Just as some people lose a large amount of weight and their skin shrinks accordingly, there are many who are left with an apron of belly skin hanging down, that just won't go away. This says to me that they have damage to the fascia that holds the skin close to the body. I think it is probably the same on the inside as well. Some women have 18 babies like the legendary Mrs Duggar and have no prolapses (or none that were mentioned), whereas some women have prolapses before they even fall pregnant. The story of your grandma indicates to me that you *may* be have drawn the genetic short straw in this area. Or it may be related to damage at the time of a birth or constipation issues or a few other factors, or a combination.

The unevenness is something that I have experienced, until something happened and the other side of my uterus supports gave way, and my uterus came down further, but dead centre. Can't remember what happened, straining on the toilet or something stupid I did. Since then I have had less chafing and pressure on one side of my vagina and vulva, and it now actually feels much better, though the cervix is now down near the introitus, where it has stayed for the last two years, sometimes even moving up a bit.

If I sit and slouch my pelvis and have a look with a mirror I can easily get my cervix to peek right out and all the convolutions of my anterior wall to bulge, but in posture it *never* peeks. I try not to do this very often as I think it is better for them all to practice staying indoors, as bearing down is only going to do more damage. I have another forty or so years in this body (I am an only child and my Mum is 96 and still continent!) so I am taking as few risks as possible.

If you must check, stand in posture and , or lie on your back with a pillow under your upper torso and feel that way. This will give you a much more accurate finger picture of what is where. It sounds to me like you have a very good finger picture of inside your vagina. The pipe thingy on the anterior wall may be your urethra. What happens if you have a feel while on your elbows and knees? Does it disappear? I hope so, cos in this position your bladder moves forwards and freeing (unkinking) your urethra so you can pee properly. This is the principle of peeing on hands and knees to empty your bladder completely. It is illustrated in Christine's book. No doubt Alemama has explained this to you anyway. Cheers
to Alemama.

Hope this helps.

Louise

alemama

May 18, 2008 - 9:31am

Now don't you all go hating me. I am so excited to see my girl babygotback here on the WW forum. I wish so much that everyone I talked to about my prolapse would join this site. So big thank yous for showing your face here!
I am sure you will get some more answers here- the weekend is usually slow so give us a few days.

Mostly what I think you are trying to puzzle out is 1. the accordian tissue 2. the sensation before and after a BM and 3. what will happen after the next baby.

is that right? oh ya and 4. the half-pipe thing.

I gotta run now but I will be back- I am remembering some old posts about the drain pipe....I will search them later.
viacondios

babygotback

May 18, 2008 - 10:16am

Well, I guess I am looking to know if the half-pipe deal is normal, if the back of my vaginal wall is supposed to be tight or if it is supposed to be wrinkled or muscular or what, does the bulge go up with consistent posture and non-straining etc.?, and I am hoping to find support about the next birth not messing me up more ;) (winking and batting eyes hopefully). I am really concerned about this accordian-looking tissue that is escaping my entry. It definitely was not there years ago and I am worried about it progressing. Thanks, Louise, for giving perspective on this.

Another question I had was: is squatting bad for this. It feels like the pelvis curves under and it smashes the abs, so I imagine this is bad, but man, it sure is common in most cultures and very natural for me with my little ones.

I notice mixed feelings here about kegel exercises. Are y'all anti? I can see avoiding the very superficial sphincter exercises, but the deeper elevator style seems like a good thing. I think it is a natural exercise because you do it often without thinking, like perhaps during lovemaking. I am not dead-set on sticking with the exercise (goodness knows I am terrible at consistency), but I wanted to see what the idea is here about it. I appreciate that you are opening and communicating about this topic, something I have not seen before. Christine, you are a real pioneer. I am very open to your experience, ladies, and am grateful for the imput.

Thanks!
babygotback

granolamom

May 18, 2008 - 11:48am

I only have a min, my baby's grabbing for the keyboard, but re: squatting...I find its not too bad if you squat like a native (ie, with your bum sticking way out behind you) rather than the way I used to squat (ie, bum underneath you). make any sense?

in time you'll be able to answer all these ???'s for yourself, its a matter of getting to know your body and the relationship between prolapse and posture.

and fwiw, my post-prolapse birth did not mess me up more, it just brought me my blessed little guy whom I would not trade in for the world's most perfect vagina anyway.

louiseds

May 19, 2008 - 1:52am

Hi Babygotback

The accordian thingy is called rugae and it is a way that the vagina kind of folds itself up into a small thing for sex, but can open out into a big birth canal for babies heads. I'm not sure how it happens, but if that is what it is, then it is absolutely normal. Also, if your cervix is a little lower than normal, it will probably wrinkle a little more, cos there is less distance between the cervix and the introitus. Also, if the woman has never been pregnant it is usually tucked up out of view. I had no idea what it was like before babies, cos I never explored around in there. Silly me. Maybe the rugae were there, maybe they weren't. Actually, I suspect they weren't, cos my uterus has always been retroverted, so it used to poke out the back wall (not the front), so I guess the front wall was more stretched out for that to happen. My back wall is like the view from a car window, always changing, depending on what is in my rectum and what time of the month it is, and whether or not the rectocele is there. Sometimes it just appears for a week or so, usually with a spot of constipation, then disappears again. When my cystocele is evident, it is like a big pillow and fills out all the rugae, so they disappear. Talk about a changing landscape!!

Re the kegels, I personally think it is important to have all your body's muscles working well. The muscles of the pelvic floor are quite important sexwise. If they are asleep on the job sex would be less nice for everyone concerned, I think. Also, I think the sensation is better with muscles that work. However, they are thin and sinewy, and not designed to hold anything up or to be bulked up, like say, leg muscles.

They are really only useful for providing a back wall for the pelvic cavity and maintaining continence, and as sex toys, and the nerves that supply them do get squashed during birth, so they usually need some nudging after the birth, to get them operating properly again.

I only do them for fun, and may only do a few a day, if that, but I am about 21 years postpartum, so mine are pretty well recovered from my last baby's birth. ;-) Christine tells us that they get exercised every day while we are walking, because the opposite sides of the pelvis alternately nutate and counternutate around the sacro-iliac joints, so they are contracting and relaxing all the time, as the shape of the pelvic diaphragm changes. You probably have to read the chapter on Pelvic Organ Support in Saving the Wholewoman, edition 2, to understand why.

Hope this explains a bit more.

Louise

Christine

May 19, 2008 - 9:30am

Hi Babygotback,

Just want to chime in that your anatomy sounds quite normal. Mine is similar to yours when I push my cervix all the way up so I can feel my cystocele. The half-pipe front wall feels firm and squishy because it’s actually the backside of the bladder we are feeling through the wall. Back vaginal wall is full and pillow-like – and yes, stool is easily felt when the rectal vault is full.

Hope you are getting a sense of this postural work and the organs being pushed forward toward their natural positions behind the lower belly. Natural breathing (not holding in the abdominal wall) will help keep them positioned, where otherwise these conditions are progressive.

Sorry your granny was one who had to suffer the operations – but it’s good you can benefit by her experience.

Welcome to Whole Woman!

Christine

babygotback

May 19, 2008 - 12:57pm

Thank you, Louise and Christine. I feel sort of reassured. I am trying to remember what things were like pre-babies. I thought the half-pipe area was flat, now it is certainly rounder. Hope that does not mean that that my bladder is slipping. I like the idea of emptying my bladder on hands and knees or some variation. The thought that urine is possibly getting trapped behind a kinked urethra freaks me out! Christine, why did your (and others) cervix slip so far down? Why does this happen!? I remember reading of others' doing the same...I am just wondering what in the world makes this happen.

Oh, I remembered another question: chriropracters say no on sleeping belly down, but does not this seem a good position to keep things in the right spot--forward?

Thanks so much for the thoughts you all have shared and for putting yourselves out there for my learning. I really appreciate it. I have been a natural childbirth teacher for several years and assisted midwives at births. It would be really great to implement this information regularly since it is common, and does not sound terribly unnatural. I guess the goal is to not make it worse, but let what is natural be. Supporting the female body's natural positioning and health is so great to read about. I am just loving this.

Thanks so much.