When I first “cracked the code” on stabilizing and reversing prolapse, and wrote and published Saving the Whole Woman, I set up this forum. While I had finally gotten my own severe uterine prolapse under control with the knowledge I had gained, I didn’t actually know if I could teach other women to do for themselves what I had done for my condition.
So I just started teaching women on this forum. Within weeks, the women started writing back, “It’s working! I can feel the difference!”
From that moment on, the forum became the hub of the Whole Woman Community. Unfortunately, spammers also discovered the forum, along with the thousands of women we had been helping. The level of spamming became so intolerable and time-consuming, we regretfully took the forum down.
Technology never sleeps, however, and we have better tools today for controlling spam than we did just a few years ago. So I am very excited and pleased to bring the forum back online.
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Remember, the forum is here for two reasons. First, to get your questions answered by other women who have knowledge and experience to share. Second, it is the place to share your results and successes. Your stories will help other women learn that Whole Woman is what they need.
Whether you’re an old friend or a new acquaintance, welcome! The Whole Woman forum is a place where you can make a difference in your own life and the lives of thousands of women around the world!
Best wishes,
Christine Kent
Founder
Whole Woman
Comments
granolamom
April 30, 2008 - 7:00pm
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bed rest for health?
well, I do agree that postpartum women should not have to consider it a luxury to look after themselves for a few weeks (months?), and should not feel pressured to resume taking on a complete workload soon after childbirth.
and I do agree, that especially in light of this pudendal nerve thing, that pp women really do need to stack the odds of complete healing in their favor.
but bed rest??
they don't even recommend that for acute back pain anymore. it just isn't what a body needs to recover/prevent an orthopedic/structural problem. not only does it put the pelvis in a position conducive to developing a prolapse, but it isn't good for digestion (who needs constipation postpartum??), respiratory function or blood flow. and NOT good for the mood either.
that said, I am all for new moms napping when their baby naps, and resting as needed.
I didn't look up all the references, but does she have any studies that show that the '40 day lie-in' is effective in reducing the incidence of pp POP? honestly, it would surprise me.
louiseds
April 30, 2008 - 8:38pm
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Lying in
Hi Christine
I would like to investigate this lying in thing a little further with Melinda before dismissing it entirely. I agree with Granolamom and you that there is something affirming a woman's need to go easy for a while after birth. Let's just find about some more about what she is saying before dismissing her advice. I think you will find that we have a lot of common ground, and that building on that common ground will lead to better understanding by all of us, if informed people listen carefully to each other, particularly where their expertise is different from ours, and the level of understanding of each other's recommendations can be limited by that lack of sophisticated understanding of the other person's field.
eg, I was amazed to read Mary O'Dwyer's book, My Pelvic Flaw, and to read about how comprehensive the treatment of pelvic flaw conditions is these days, far better than the 1980's. I think that WW would endorse most of these treatments. I think the book has a major, fundamental problem though, which would prevent me from recommending it as a good reference or guide for women. This illustrates to me how an author can have so much useful stuff to say, much of which is very beneficial to the reader, but which shows a lack of understanding of the body, as you and I would see it. I will talk about this elsewhere, as it is not strictly on topic for this blog entry of yours.
Let's also wait until we hear from Helena Frawley, Melinda Cooper's colleague, and find out what she has to say.
Let's get them to talk to us. It is a pity we are so geographically distant. I hope to be able to talk face to face with some of these Australian researchers if I can get to the other side of Oz at any time. It is less than satisfactory trying to understand each other via text only, and while we do it all in text, via Blogs, Forums and email, I think we have to be extra thorough in our attempts to communicate clearly and listen to each other very carefully, lest the messages be misunderstood or misconstrued.
Cheers
Louise
babygotback
May 22, 2008 - 10:50pm
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post partum activity
I am trying to understand this article, and I am sure I will reread it again with a dictionary nearby, but I am confused.
Am I to understand that the 40-day lying in and pampering mom that happens in some countries is not helpful to humans as we might think? Practically speaking, I can imagine that the extremes are the problem. A woman generally feels quite good getting up and getting about at her will, but when pressured to stay in bed or pressured to get out comes the trouble. I am speaking so simply, and hoping not to miss the boat. I have been teaching natural childbirth for several years and in this method, we teach that a woman who has all her faculties and has been able to birth according to her own wits (i.e. not being told to push or to be in unnatural positions or subject to unnatural timing or outside pressures) has the strength and health to get right up and walk out of a hospital with her baby and get on with life as she feels able, to be able to trust her instincts and senses. On the other hand, it is easily discovered by any post partum mom early on in rebounding from the huge experience of birth that if she is overly strained physically by a lot of activity early on, she will bleed unnecessarily much and lose more blood than is needful. It is a sign she is overly exerting herself at home, usually trying to pick up household activities or lifting older children a lot.
So, can we not say that it is in the extremes that we find the trouble, or is this article, I am supposing authored by Christine, rejecting the idea of lying-in in any form?
Seeking clarification on this important topic...
louiseds
May 22, 2008 - 11:19pm
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Good point
I think you have made a really good point, Babygotback. I think on the whole women are pretty good at doing things when they are good and ready, but western reality, lifestyles and media conspire to turn us into superwomen who feel they have to *do* a lot to meet their own and others' expectations of them. Let's face it, in a nuclear family with toddlers and preschoolers and Dad going to work each day, there is a lot of responsibility (real or assumed) that falls on new Mums. Also, there are many women who are psyching themselves and training their tiny babies up for daycare, when they return to work a few months hence. There are also a lot of women who cannot go to bed with a sink full of dirty dishes, or a gleaming floor, or folded washing.
I'm not one of them, and while a certain amount of hygiene is important, some women are unable to separate essential domestic chores from optional chores (like sweeping up leaves in autumn, making gourmet meals every night, polishing socks and cleaning windows.)
I think this is another area of life and community that we have lost; the ability to listen to our bodies and let them dictate a bit more (as new Mums), and the collective responsibility that we all have to be a part of the village that raises each child and looks after each Mum when she has new babies.
Likewise, as women we need to carefully assess what we are doing out of need, and what we are doing out of guilt, and be able to justify domestic and family laziness sometimes for the longer term wellbeing of our female bodies. Even *I* have learnt the art of 'selective helplessness' over the last few years, and that is something that I had previously frowned on, after half a lifetime of priding myself on my physical strength, ability and competence!! Now I value my newly discovered skills in the cunning department, and I ensure that I no longer always get the burnt steak!
Cheers
Louise
alemama
May 22, 2008 - 11:54pm
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pulmonary embolism
the risk increases with bed rest. One of the more real risks associated with childbirth. I don't think she (the author) is saying do nothing- and I don't really support her hypothesis that POP would be prevented by bed rest after birth- but I like the advice to lift only baby and nurse in bed.
Christine
May 23, 2008 - 8:09am
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importance of restoring the pelvis itself
I think many mothers would go crazy lying around this much, unless they really needed a long vacation. But that’s really beside the point. The point I’m making is that the pelvis itself has been pushed into and living in its most unstable position for WEEKS prior to birth. By this time the baby itself is sealing off the ‘genital hiatus’, but is also holding the pelvis in counternutation. Remember all the completely relaxed ligaments – the immediately postpartum pelvis must look very big indeed! Also, the bladder and rectum have been (mercifully) pushed well into their proper positions by the big baby in the middle.
After birth, there must be significant osseous remodeling to bring the pelvis back to neutral. This can only be done by proper weight loading from above, i.e. sitting and standing with the lumbar curve in place. The breath (intraabdominal pressure) cannot adequately pin the organs into position without this mechanism. This Must be why postpartum prolapse almost always shows up weeks down the line.
Lying in or no lying in – (an old upper-crust English concept, no doubt, but I understand other cultures are known for it too) pp women need to understand the central mechanism of pelvic organ support and how theirs has been compromised, as well as how it is easily restored.
Btw, these are the sorts of marvelous human studies that would serve humankind so well and one would think would’ve been carried out decades ago.
Christine
queenmother
October 1, 2008 - 11:41am
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Wow
I have been secretly a little angry with my husband for pushing me to do more with the kids right after my second was born, thinking it was because I didn't rest as much that the prolapses developed. But this is really interesting: After my first birth, I had a third degree tear and lots of stitches. The only position I could maintain comfortably was sitting straight up, with my weight evenly distributed on my bottom. (I couldn't stand for long, though.) I had to sit with correct posture because anything else would cause a pulling sensation in my perineum.
After the second birth with only a 2nd degree tear, I was much more comfortable and could sit up in bed to nurse the baby. Standing was pretty uncomfortable again, so I didn't do much of that either time. But my posture was surely atrocious because I was on the couch so much and this time I could comfortably sit in just the position that we are supposed to avoid - leaning back, tailbone tucking under, slouched... A few weeks later I found the cystocele, and a rectocele followed.
Hmmm...
Sarah