When I first “cracked the code” on stabilizing and reversing prolapse, and wrote and published Saving the Whole Woman, I set up this forum. While I had finally gotten my own severe uterine prolapse under control with the knowledge I had gained, I didn’t actually know if I could teach other women to do for themselves what I had done for my condition.
So I just started teaching women on this forum. Within weeks, the women started writing back, “It’s working! I can feel the difference!”
From that moment on, the forum became the hub of the Whole Woman Community. Unfortunately, spammers also discovered the forum, along with the thousands of women we had been helping. The level of spamming became so intolerable and time-consuming, we regretfully took the forum down.
Technology never sleeps, however, and we have better tools today for controlling spam than we did just a few years ago. So I am very excited and pleased to bring the forum back online.
If you are already a registered user you may now log in and post. If you have lost your password, just click the request new password tab and follow the directions.
Please review and agree to the disclaimer and the forum rules. Our moderators will remove any posts that are promotional or otherwise fail to meet our guidelines and will block repeat offenders.
Remember, the forum is here for two reasons. First, to get your questions answered by other women who have knowledge and experience to share. Second, it is the place to share your results and successes. Your stories will help other women learn that Whole Woman is what they need.
Whether you’re an old friend or a new acquaintance, welcome! The Whole Woman forum is a place where you can make a difference in your own life and the lives of thousands of women around the world!
Best wishes,
Christine Kent
Founder
Whole Woman
louiseds
March 20, 2009 - 8:41am
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POP?
Hi Lyricmama
"I feel like I should trust my doctor (after all she must know more about prolapses than I do)". Well, that's a loaded statement! I don't think you do entirely trust her, and I can understand that, as your observations are different from yours. You live in your body. She doesn't. Keep reading Christine's work and get to know your body, and you will soon know far more than your doc about POP!
I think doctors are given far too much credit for knowing more than the rest of us about our bodies. About some things definitely! But about others, well, maybe not. You either trust her or you don't. What you do about it is a different matter.
Just remember that Wholewoman techniques are good for your body, prolapse or not. Also remember that your body will be recovering for over 12 months. Maybe you will have POP then, and maybe you won't. Many women have saggy bits for many months, just cos they have been pregnant and given birth. Give it time. Love your baby and be patient. Lots of healing will happen.
Cheers
Louise
lyricmama
March 20, 2009 - 9:35am
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Thank you Louise for the
Thank you Louise for the encouragement. If I have a prolapse it really isn't interfering with my life (although I avoid heavy lifting) and if I don't at least I may prevent one in the future by adopting Christine's lifestyle changes. I just wish I had a diagnosis so that I could move on and stop wondering "is there a prolapse or not?". More than anything I am so frustrated that there are no pregnancy and childbirth books that warn us about this! I did as much as I could to ensure an easy birth(no epidural, episiotomy, forceps). I think I did have fairly significant lacerations(my baby was almost nine pounds and came flying out!) but the doctor who delivered my baby said that I tore right where he would have done an episiotomy. I'm pretty sure I have a low rectocele which is usually caused by birth trauma. Who knows. I guess I wont really know for sure so I should stop obsessing!
Mae
March 20, 2009 - 12:51pm
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Second opinion
Hi lyricmama,
Any chance you can get a second opinion? That might put your mind to rest..it sounds like you really need to know one way or the other.
Warm regards,
~Mae
alemama
March 20, 2009 - 7:10pm
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self exam article
right here on the main website. Do your own- that is the best way!
louiseds
March 21, 2009 - 3:51am
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Thankyou Loiuise for the
Hi Lyricmama
A second opinion might be helpful, but as Alemama says, have a look at Resoureces > Articles > Prolapse Self Exam on the main website. You can make up your own mind.
Hmm, strange that you should mention obsessing. A lot of women find they obsess about it. It can be quite upsetting to continue to worry about it and examine yourself all the time. Normally we suggest only once a week if you must check regularly. There is no benefit to be had by doing it more often.
How you feel in the vulval area in everyday situations is more of a measure. Even then, it is what you don't feel, or when you don't feel it, that is more significant than what you can find when you take a look (if that makes any sense at all). ie you feel the unpleasant fullness less often, and have less trouble emptying the bowel as time goes by, if you practise Wholewoman techniques properly.
As for the Ob's comment that the laceration is just where he would have done an episiotomy. Well, derr! You didn't need an epi, did you? And if you did, you may have torn anyway. It often happens, then it is worse. You didn't make the wrong decision.
Cheers
Louise
lyricmama
March 23, 2009 - 12:44pm
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Thank you all for your
Thank you all for your support! It is so hard not to totally obsess over this. But as my father sayed when I told my parents I thought I had a prolapse "There is something very deeply disturbing about your internal organs not being in the right place!" (my dad is a doctor so I feel comfortable talking about "feminine" health with him). I do think he is right though, that it is just plain weird to know that your organs have shifted.
I really am starting to wonder if most women don't have some degree of prolapse after giving birth. My rectocele is probably very minor(it doesnt give me any symptoms and my doctor didn't see it) and I wonder if maybe I wouldnt have noticed if I hadn't been so curious. I wish there were more concrete studies on postpartum vaginas!
lovely rita
March 23, 2009 - 6:22pm
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postpartum vaginas
I agree lyricmama-- there needs to be a database, with tons of info about the range of normal when it comes to postpartum vaginal shape, size, and overall condition.
bad_mirror
March 23, 2009 - 7:22pm
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Me three
Alemama had a post about how every one of her friends in their childbearing years reported some degree of prolapse, but her mother who had 4 kids in 8 years did not. She went on to theorize that prolapse happens to just about every woman, but that it does go away with time. I love this idea, because it gives me so much hope. It's hard to believe that our bodies don't get a "do-over." People who have major life-threatening injuries often recover to near normal given the right treatment and TIME. I pray this is the same for postpartum prolapse. To be honest, I wouldn't have known about mine if I hadn't been looking at how my tear was healing. I kind of regret opening that Pandora's Box, but that is a whole 'nother story. Ignorance can truly be bliss, I think! Anyway, I agree with you ladies. I wish my midwife, and then the OB I saw had said, "this happens a lot, and it goes away a lot." (I can't tell you how many web searches I did for vagina pictures, hoping that one would look like mine)! Instead, all of my knowledge has come from here.
lyricmama
March 24, 2009 - 10:31am
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first of all I think it's
first of all I think it's funny that I spelled "Said" "Sayed". Wow I think that my brain has prolapsed too (I really hope that can't happen). Has anyone seen that show about the family with 18 children? There was an episode where the mother's OBGYN was talking about the risk of prolapse in women who have had that many children. She then went on the say that Mrs Duggar's pelvic floor is holding up really well! I couldn't believe it. Here I am in my 20s with one baby and a very easy labor and an (undiagnosed) prolapse. GRRRRR. Of course, maybe her OBGYN can't tell if she has a prolapse.
louiseds
March 25, 2009 - 2:09am
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first of all I think it's
Re "maybe her OBGYN can't tell if she has a prolapse. " ROFL!! More than likely. But some women do get lucky. I think genetic variation has something to do with it. Otherwise she probably would have crossed her knees earlier. ;-)
Doctors do have a lot to gain by diagnosing a condition, then profiting from fixing it. Many medical conditions do resolve with time, and many of us do run off to consult the doctor in the blink of an eye. No wonder modern women have more prolapses than our mothers and grandmothers, who had very little contact with doctors, and great faith in the passage of time. We want it all, and we want it now. The medical quick fix is a modern phenomenon. Time is something we are always short of.
Come to think of it, I wonder what those early panty girdles were for? Support of course! Why else would you shut your vulva up in a pair of heavy grade elastic shorts and have to wrestle with them every time you wanted a pee?
Louise
lyricmama
March 25, 2009 - 10:01am
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I think you're very right
I think you're very right about needing everything right away. We are a very impatient culture. In some ways that's good because it pushes advancements that make quality of life a little better, but it can really make a person go nutty! Especially a new mommy who just wants her body back after 9 months of pregnancy!!!
Not to digress but I find it interesting that we have so much trouble dealing with our new bodies after pregnancy. In the early days of man, women probably got pregnant very shortly after they first started menstruating. They never really had time to get attached to their pubescent pre pregnancy bodies like we do. We spend years relishing in our tight tummies, perky breasts and relatively intact vaginas. It's no wonder we are so mortified by what happens to us! On top of it we have to care for another human after years of self pampering. We get used to things being easy and then the rug gets pulled out from underneath our feet.
louiseds
March 25, 2009 - 8:49pm
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Having a great body
Yes, we have the luxury of selfish vanity. And when you think about it most women's bodies rebel at the first sign of pregnancy, whether it be nausea, sore boobs, overactive kidneys or whatever. Then there is the ballooning until we feel like Violet Beauregard in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory, the heartburn, the labour, the helplessness of having a newborn and living in a body which is more akin to a half deflated exercise ball than a human woman's body, with its ever producing milk factories, which used to be referred to as 'great norks' or some other endearing term of affection. The list goes on. And all this happens in under twelve months. It is as if one's body is invaded by aliens. No wonder we have a hard time getting used to stuff that women in primitive societies regard as normal, or don't even think about because they are busy just surviving the process.
And no wonder it takes a couple of years to get back to a semblance of a normally functioning body again. You can't just fix it with Photoshop!
BUT Lyricmama, there is good news. By the time you are 56 all that pert body stuff is just a distant memory, and those women who have not had the privilege of birthing have sagging bodies, and maybe POPs as well. LOL. The boot is on the other foot. I look at my mostly-very-civilised, three adult children that I birthed and suckled, and realise that a pert body is wasted on the young, but it really mean little in the longrun.
Age does indeed bring perspective. For that I am very grateful. When I finally grow up I might even have some wisdom. I am sure you will experience this too. You just have to be patient.
Cheers
Louise