help, having hard time staying positive

hi there aussielou

take a deep long breath and {{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}

anxiety is the pits. I am a very anxious person and come from a long line of anxious people, married one and am raising a couple more. so I know anxiety, lol!

I know you say the anxiety is about the POP and not the thyroid, but I'm sure you know that thyroid issues can cause anxiety, not the 'I'm worried about my thyroid issues' kind but the 'my wackadoo hormones are causing my brain to feel anxious' kind. I had a postpartum thyroiditis after my first was born, had an overactive thyroid and omg, it brought new meaning to the word 'anxiety'! that's when I first started having panic attacks, but I digress...

you asked what to do about the anxiety....
I can tell you how *I* manage mine, and it may or not prove helpful to you. take it or leave it as it suits you.
first, when I find myself getting anxious I remind myself that my brain is playing tricks on me. whatever is the subject of my anxiety is not really dangerous or scary or whatever, its just the craziness that takes place in my head. I tell myself its like saying no to the second chocolate chip cookie...the more you do it the easier it gets. the more you give in to the craving and cave, well, the easier it gets to do that too. so I try to coach myself to ignore the 'lies' my brain cooks up. and then I reward myself for doing so.usually with a chocolate chip cookie : )
then, I GET BUSY. doing anything. action inhibits anxiety. distract yourself. do something that makes you feel powerful or strong. run on the treadmill. clean out a closet. run an errand for a friend. whatever it takes, just do something positive.
I stay away from the tv and the news. when I'm anxious I dont need the additional negativity and believe me, the world goes on without my knowing about every horrible thing going on around me for a couple of days.
now, about your POP. 2 months and you already see positive change? that's fantastic! took me much longer. I wouldnt worry much about vaginal elasticity. I'm not sure exactly what it means that its 'weak'. does she mean you lack elasticity or that its loose? either way, probably not a prerequisite for managing prolapse. each of us has our own unique set of challenges pertaining to management of prolapse, whether its an episiotomy botch-up, neuromuscular impairment, prior pelvic surgery, or whatever. we work with what we have.
affirmations work well for me with issue-specific anxiety. come up with a few sentences 'I am strong. I am healthy. My body is learning to support my bladder.' whatever feels nice. say it a few times a day. picture yourself feeling good, healthy and strong. your mind is powerful, and imo, more effective than a strong pelvic floor.
you will get through this.
(((hugs)))

Hi Aussielou

I did a two week intensive cognitive behaviour therapy course of which CBT was only one of the therapies. We did a long walk every day as part of the program. Each person made the commitment to do some daily exercise as a part of their recovery. It is amazing the effect of just getting out and walking somewhere else and back again for 20-30 minutes each day. It uses up the adrenalin that is produced during anxiety, and gets it out of your body so you feel less keyed up when you get back. You get fresh air into your lungs and get out and see a different world from that between your four walls. It also gives you a feeling of progressing on as you move towards things and then away from them again, leaving them behind you. It is also unashamed, guilt-free 'me' time that is an investment in your recovery. Sometimes we just beat up on ourselves for not being able to change, or be better, or less anxious. It's nice to give yourself little treats like time to yourself, when you promise not to try and be anyone other than your lovely and loved self.

You are also going through some adjustments, thyroid wise, and trying to make sense of it all. I am sure that you will find that you will be more comfortable eventually with things that are still unfamiliar. Give it time.

Louise

I only have a moment, but wanted to give a bit of encouragement. So many of us are dealing with health issues other than prolapse: physical challenges, emotional issues, economic hardships, loss, pain and on and on. You are right, there is no way of knowing, certainly no science on the matter, what the connection is between your thyroid condition and your prolapse. The best you can do is make sure your medication is well-regulated and support your body every way you can. We all have to work with what we have and, like Deepak Chopra says, "This moment is perfect", meaning everything and every decision up to this point have brought you to this moment. There is nothing to do but accept it all and go forward with eyes open. ((((((Hugs)))))))

"2 months and you already see positive change? that's fantastic! took me much longer."
Hi granolamom, thanks for your ever encouraging words. I'd like to know how long it took for the actual posture to become natural to you? I'm two months in and still having trouble properly picking myself up in to ww posture, much less seeing actual results. I never before realized I was such a sloucher.

Well, I'm not granolamom- I can tell it it probably takes as long as anything else does to become a habit. But these days I am finding myself slouching something fierce! Our new baby is about 3 months- and you would think that it would be natural for me after over 4 years of doing it (almost 5 now) but I have not been well- and it takes a great deal of health and energy and vitality (in my opinion of course) to *be* in the posture. It's very energetic. In a way, pulling up into the posture wakes me up. It makes me more aware and awake. It energizes me.
I am working to put myself in bed when I feel the slouching start. I want to respect my energy levels right now, not drain them. So when I start slouching, it's a sure sign I'm tired. I take a quick rest and back to the posture I go.
I guess the thing for me is that after doing this for almost 5 years- I know when I'm out. It's not a thinking thing- reminding myself to get in- it more of a feeling thing- knowing I'm out. make sense?

it took me a long time to really 'get' the posture. I learned it little bits at a time and so I cant really say how long it took for the actual posture to become natural. I do remember I used to make a habit of pulling up into WW posture every hr on the hr. eventually, it would be 2:00 pm and I'd think to pull up and realize hey, I'm already in posture! cool!
it was a slow process for me. lots of unlearning.
there's no rush, really. go easy on yourself, it will come.
and I agree with alemama, when I'm unwell, its really hard to stay in posture.

Alemama I think you hit the nail on the head. I think it's amazing how simply practicing posture makes you aware of so many other facets of your life. Whole, indeed.

So I've been fasting for the past 10 or so days - no food or drink from dawn till sunset, so for like 14+ hrs (religious reasons). What with having to run after little ones and feed a nursling, I've been trying to conserve energy as much as possible. That includes a lot of lounging around and horizontal positions. Here's the cool thing - like two weeks ago I noticed for the first time that my front vaginall wall was starting to actually feel like a wall. I had always wondered before that why it was referred to as a "wall". I mean, why not "front vaginal bulge" or "anterior lump" or something. I'd read descriptions on here of front walls feeling "concave" or "like a half pipe" and had no idea what those descriptions meant. I actually had no idea how badly misplaced my bladder was until it started to reposition. Anyway so when I noticed this flattening of the bulge for a few days, I got really excited and revved up to write an update on the forum. Well a few days later, any indication of a "wall" had disappeared into the bulge again. I now realize that this coincided with a day or two after beginning my fasting/horizontal postioning. When I first noticed the appearance of a front wall, I thought, oh maybe it's not the posture at work here, so much as it is normal postpartum reversion. Well, now I know.

I think I'll try your every hour on the hour "pull up", granolamom, cuz I still have a few weeks left of this fasting=bummyness stuff. Thanks, ladies.

Hi chickaboom

I'm 6 months into trying to keep the posture, and although I often fail, I'm actually beginning to enjoy it!

Although I have tried to sit cross-legged or with legs tucked under in a kneel/sit position as Christine shows on her DVD, I really find that difficult. I do sit upright at the computer and also we have bar stools with straight backs that seem to be good. How do you and others manage when it comes to evenings and sitting down with family in an easy chair? I have just mentioned this on another thread (reply to apis mellifera). Am thinking of ordering a tub chair with vertical back to provide some comfort - what do other people use?

Marigold

Hi Marigold.

I was miserable wherever I sat - didn't matter what kind, type, style or shape.

Last Christmas I was gifted with an Amish made rocker/glider. I visited Pennsylvania last year and wanted to bring one home with me but DH said I'd look like "Granny" on Beverly Hillbilles having it tied to the top of the vehicle!! I know, I could have had it shipped, but the cost was high.

We went to an Amish showroom here in Texas where I could sit in several different chairs. I really wanted one of those cushy, soft extremely sink into it rockers - but very quickly I could feel my lower lumbar collapsing into the space between the seat and the back, so that style was out. I ended up with a beautiful solid oak rocker/glider that fits me. Amish artisans build the wooden rockers curved to the body, so there is a nice solid wooden lumbar curve right where I need it. I actually sat in 4 or 5 wooden rockers before I chose the one I wanted. You would think they all would have felt the same, but not so. I could feel differences in the shape of the seats, parts of the back or where the lumbar curve in the wood was. I do have a very thin cushion on the seat and lightweight soft blanket over the back since I haven't had the energy to make one. Oh yes, I also got the glider ottoman and really enjoy sitting and stretching out my legs now.

Blessings,
Grandma Joy

Hi Grandma Joy

Does your wonderful glider/rocker have a brand?

What is the name of the Amish showroom in Texas?

Members might be able to pull up a website for one or the other and check them out. Thankfully there are ways for Amish to utilise mainstream society for business purposes.

Louise

hey marigold,

I don't do a whole lot of chair and couch sitting but when I do I find that sitting at the very edge of my seat helps me to maintain posture best. couches are the worst, sinking into one used to make my insides feel all scrunched up long before I knew anything about proper female posture. have you tried elbows and knees position for computer (laptop, iPad etc) time or for when you are reading? it's good for the pelvic organs and it feels good :)

Hi Aussielou -

I have a long history of anxiety and it really flairs up whenever I have a medical issue - even if it's just a minor issue I can start imagining the worst possible scenario to the point that I'm convinced I will die. I agree with everything the other ladies have indicated, and especially granolamom with regard to our own thoughts taking us to such dark places. I recently discovered two things in the last month that have helped my anxiety tremendoulsy and after all these years of battling it, I finally feel that I may win the battle. First, I have begun acupuncture treatments specifically for anxiety. I'm in my third week of treatment and have noticed a gradual, but significant difference in both my anxiety and depression. Second, a book entitled, "You Can Heal Your Life" by Louise Hay, explains how one's very own thinking can create anxiety and fear in one's life. She gives step by step instructions on how to change your thinking with daily exercises to perform. I have always known that my thoughts are what creates my fears, mood, affect, outlook, attitude, etc. but I did not believe I had any control over my thoughts until I started reading this book. Not only has there been a HUGE decrease in my anxiety level, but this book has had a positive impact in all areas of my life. There has been no medication (and I've tried a lot), therapy, exercise, book or anything else I've tried that has left such a positive impact on me with regard to my anxiety. This book has been around for awhile and I'm sure there are others similar in nature. I don't know if I'm finally just "getting it" (that I have been creating my own anxiety all these years) or maybe I became desperate enough in the last few months to really put effort into getting my anxiety under control. Whatever the reason, I am so happy at this moment and time in my life, despite my POP. I hope that you can find some peace soon as I know how debilitating anxiety can be.

Marric

chickaboom - I think if you are busy with the fasting, dont expect too much from yourself right now in terms of learning the posture. you wont do any irreparable damage if you wait another two weeks to start.
something always has to give, and sometimes we do have other things going on in our lives that outrank POP management.
and that's ok : )

although the comment was not addressed to me, thank you for the book recommendation.
I am always looking for more tools to add to my 'dealing with anxiety' toolbox.
do you think I will be able to use the ideas in that book to help my dd? (she's 12)

Granolamom -

I don't know that the ideas from the book will directly help your dd, however I think the book will help you in dealing with your dd. My dd is 16 and I have found since reading this book, her moodiness does not bother or impact me nearly to the degree that it used to. She has even noticed me smiling more and commented, "what are you always smiling about" (as if this is a bad thing!!). I also believe that the more emotionally healthy the parent is, the more healthy the kid will be. If my daughter didn't think she already knows everything, I would recommend it to her to read. I guess there is hope for the future.

If you get the book, I'd be interested in knowing what you think.

Marric

Hi Marric, Granolamum, and Aussielou,
I am also a great fan of this book by Louise Hay.I have mentioned it in some of my posts awhile back. Apart from my original I have a very beautiful later version with coloured pages and pictures/sketches and the pages have gold edges oh la la.
So, I digress,....I first came in touch with this book when a new friend lent me hers.I was going through a low patch and she had been told about the book when she was widowed.I couldn't put the book down, and in the end she said kindly...I need it back ! Go get your own!And I did.
I take it with me travelling, its my handbook on the plane..calms me as I'm fearful flying or ferrying.
I write affirmations down every now again to help me through.eg I reached an all time slump end of last year and only recently came out of it.(culmination of highs an lows in my family/friends in the previous 18months from when 2 close family passed away..that was the start of this build up).
In trying to pull myself out of this low I found ideas and situations presented themselves.It started with an invite from a wise GF to an evening talk , which turned into a weekly meditation class.I find that relaxing and calming.
I'd also had a few bouts of unwellness this year, so I wrote out 3 affirmations relating to the parts of my body that were unwell.Left them in the bathroom drawer, and at shower time and bedtime, I would read these affirmations while brushing my teeth. I think Louise also recommends saying them to yourself in the mirror when you can.
After the first week, I started back moisturing my body after showering, and giving my hair a treatment.These simple things were another step to good feelings.Paint your toenails a pretty colour, and feel yourself smiling when you look down at them in the shower :-).Nuture yourself.
The following week, still continuing the affirmations, I mentally asked for help,(your god, angels, spirits, whatever your beliefs) and next day reflexology was suggested to me.I felt positive results from the first session.Ive now had 3 and will possibly have 2-3 more and then stop.Im sure accupuncture would have good results too.We all have our own needs and likes and if we start listening to our bodys signals, step by step we recover.
I also started rereading this book at breakfast time.Just a few pages every morning, as that is my quiet time, but for others it may not be, so whenever you have a quiet time, sit down with a nice cuppa and have a read.It helped me to jot down some prompts that I found useful and encouraging.Strategies for back up.
Marric Im so glad you mentioned it ,and granolamum-re;your daughter, it will be up to her, you can but try.I have had mixed feedback from my family.Hubby and one son tried affirmations for awhile, other two not interested.But in the end its made a huge difference to how I see, feel and look at life.I hope you find the same and I wish you all, the best.
It's been hard for me to find the energy to do the Pop exercises etc, while all this has been happenign in my life, the Posture has been the main focus for me, and I do bits of exercise here and there.That is my next focus,to be more consistent with Christine's exercises and diet.
This week I reached a "high" a feeling of my old bright self back, I thought Id lost her!Yippee! remember one positive step at a time, no matter how little, helps and adds up .Louise tells us this, and Rome wasn't built in a day :-] but it was built! Smile everyone! xxx and let your soul shine!
(see I told you I was on a high now....)

Hi Aussielou

One of the things that keeps me on the level sometimes when I think life is getting away from me is to seek inspiration from different friends I have who have disabilities or family members who have serious disabilities that they will carry to the grave. I am learning that many of my friends have incredible inner strength that I can only wonder at. Could I ever have that much strength?

Living in a small country town brings me into regular contact with many people I would never come across if I lived in suburbia.

Yes, you have some big challenges, probably the biggest of which is to be clear in your head about whether or not it will be beneficial to have further surgical procedures.

The evidence is that further pelvic repair procedures will be less likely to succeed than the first procedure. You may be better to just deal with your body the way it is. The choice is completely up to you, whatever you decide.

I think it is important for you to find out from your doctor exactly which procedures were done. 'Not suturing the bladder to the wall', and 'not using mesh' does not constitute telling you what *was* done to your body, and it doesn't tell you why the prolapse is now falling again. It is your body, after all, and you are the one who has to manage it. That will be impossible unless you know how your pelvic interior has been changes.

I suggest that you get the doctor to either email you the names of the procedures, or get the information in writing from the hospital where it was done. You may need to apply formally through the Freedom of Information Act. Then you can google the terms and take your time to familiarise yourself with the changes that were made.

BTW, recurrence of prolapse after surgical repair is reasonably common.

The way to take the pressure off your pelvic floor is to use your posture to move your pelvic organs forward onto your pubic bones. This will make your pelvic floor more diagonal than horizontal, and your pelvic floor will carry less weight as well. Some of the weight of your pelvic organs will be transferred to your relaxed, lower abdominal wall. You will understand this better when you see the DVD and the diagrams in the book. ou can also check out Christine Kent's Youtube channel, Wholewomaninc, which has excerpts of the DVDs on it. Happy reading, viewing and exercising.

Louise

Aussielou -

There are so many new and effective medications out there for anxiety/depression that I feel certain you will find one that will help you get through this difficult time. Once you are less anxious and clear-headed, the book may be even more helpful to you. I was glad to hear that Kiwigirl has also benefited from the book as it reinforces my new found belief that we create our own reality and have the power to change it if we so choose. You are right about needing patience. I tend to be very impatient too and want things fixed immediately. I'm gradually trying to accept my place in life at any given moment. Just like the WW posture, it takes lots of practice before it comes easily.

Please let us know how things work out.

Marric

now that you mention it, I do remember you talking about this a while back. I guess I was not yet in a place to hear it : )
everything in its time
will check that book out on amazon as soon as I'm done catching up on the forums here.
another reason I love WW......I'm always learning something from you gals, even if it doesnt directly pertain to POP.
{{{group hug}}}

hi aussielou
think of it like dieting. when you start a weight loss program, very often you see results relatively quickly. and then its just a few ounces a week, if that. slowly slowly and by the time your new habits are no longer at the forefront of your mind, suddenly you realize you're down another two pounds.
and like my weight anyway, POP management has a tendency to be 'two steps forward, one step back' so it gets hard to keep track of progress.

my third child was born when my oldest was almost 5. very hectic years, the work is so physically and emotionally demanding. do you have help? family nearby? social support? it is so important that a young mother be well supported, I am learning that as I get older. G-d willing I will be able to provide that for the next generation because I see a direct correlation between my lack of support at various times and my depression. its not a depression 'because I have no support' its just being on my own in that way depleted my resources to completely, that the depression/anxiety found their way in.

how long until the thyroid stuff balances out? you may find that helps alleviate some of the depression.

hi aussielou, sounds like you are doing what you can to help yourself out of this funk. hopefully the depression/anxiety will start to lift soon and you can get back to the business of enjoying life.
I often wonder why my journey is what it is, but just as often I am blessed by moments of clarity when I have understanding. usually later on, when a prior struggle proves useful for a current issue or enables me to help someone else.
hang in there, good times are around the corner!
(((love)))
gmom

:-)