From Surviving to all of you

Dear Surviving 60,
You were there for me from the beginning of my journey here.
You are a strong woman & I hold you in the highest esteem for what you do 24/7 supporting all of us here.
If it wasn't for Christine & her family's strength, along with you & this community, we all wouldn't be where we are today.
Thankyou for all you do,
BIG (((hug)))
In our journey together,
Aussie Soul Sister

Please keep harping about posture! We all need the reminder. When I am feeling lazy, I hear your voice "soft belly, shoulders down, lift chest up". That is what whole woman is about, and there are so many here that appreciate your vigilance and your strong belief in what we are doing here in the first place!!
Thanks so much for being you!!

Responding to every post on this forum is an overwhelming task, and yet we want to welcome each new member and do our best to show her around.
Sometimes gentle hand holding is the best action to take as a woman begins her prolapse journey and other times a pep talk is in order and sometimes even a little tough love can really help and the best part is that there are so many women here sometimes we can have it all in one thread!
That said, there have been countless occasions here where the written word is misinterpreted. It is what it is. So much of our human language is comprised of facial expressions and body positioning.
That's why I like to always assume positive intent and give the benefit of the doubt when it seems like someone is fussy or didn't seem to get what I am saying.
We are all here to help each other and it is best if everyone can remember that and try very hard to avoid inflammatory statements.
I say to my kids: is it kind? WIll it lift someone up? Will it help? and these are the kinds of questions I ask myself before I respond to a thread, especially if I'm feeling annoyed or offended by something someone wrote. Many times I walk away and leave it to someone else to walk those delicate egg shells :)
Surviving, you are doing just fine! We need you here responding. The best person for the job is the person who is willing to do the job :) Can you imagine in all the posts that you've responded to that you would somehow manage to never offend someone? Women are coming here upset, frustrated, depressed. Sometimes it's just a matter of time before someone goes off! This will pass soon, and we will have all learned something interesting from it.

It's all good, even the stuff that doesn't seem that way.

I too hear your 'voice' in my head every day "chest up", and it helps me pull into the posture again! I also notice that you and Fab and a few others are always the first to respond to posts and no post it seems goes unanswered, it was my first day not so long ago and my first post that you answered and I can't thank you enough. As the saying goes 'you can please some people some of the time but you can't please all the people all the time' I hope you will continue to make you 'voice' be the one of the first to be heard here. Thank you.

Let's move beyond this incident now and back to our own personal work. Today I have no Interstitial Cystitis pain. I have no prolapse issues today. I do my WW posture and body work every day now. Today I will live to ease through the severe pain of vaginal cramping. Let's move on together. Daphne11

Dear Surviving. You are a no-nonsense pragmatist and sometimes we need that and not the "sugar-coating" that in the end won't ever help things. Sometimes an abrasive tone is just the ticket to shock us back into reality and make us "take our medicine", so to speak. Some years back I asked our parish priest what I was going to do as I feared that my husband would lose his job due to a plant shutdown. Very matter-of-factly, he told me, "You'll do something else, because you will have to." People told me that was an insensitive and mean response. About six years after that meeting my fears were realized and my husband did lose his job. That was in 2009. Today he has a new job. Not quite as close to home or as high paying as before but we are doing fine. In the end, the kindest thing was exactly what our priest told me. The moral of my story is that the truth may seem blunt or uncaring, but in the end, it might just be the best way to help. Thanks for all you do and the many answers that you have given me since I came to this forum in November of 2012.

Surviving,
It was one of your posts that made me realize that I was doing firebreathing wrong. I am doing better now that I am doing it right.
My mother had what was probably a stage 4 POP. When she died at 93, I was told that her uterus was completely outside her body. We knew she was having some sort of problems for years but she wouldn't talk to any of us about it. She was always saying that she might need an operation later but she never went to a doctor either. She always seemed worried and was very short tempered with everyone she knew. It would have been a real blessing to her if she had been able to communicate with the wise women on this site. I consider myself blessed.
Thank you Surviving for all that you do, you are appreciated,
Little Bit

You were among the first to welcome me to the forum. I agree wholeheartedly with you that we must do the work ourselves, because there's no other way. In fact, if there's an 'attitude' that epitomizes WW to me, that's it. It's how I think Christine started and what she has paid forward. I value the idea of self-care and self-responsibility so much, because discovering it has changed my life. Finding a community of women who have come together to take responsibility and share it in encouraging others to find their own, I expected also to find friends who could relate it to all aspects of our lives. I have had to take some backwater in realizing the necessarily narrow focus of the forum; however, I appreciate your commitment to what has worked so well for you and defend your right to shout it from the rooftops. Whenever I pull my chest up and relax my belly (and no matter how many times a day I have to remind myself), I feel the difference immediately and have the same enthusiasm to share it with whomsoever will listen.

I feel like I would be remiss in not also acknowledging realisticwoman's effort on her own behalf and willingness to share what worked for her.....since we're not taking sides here and are willing to have peace all around and in the same spirit with which I've been treated since joining the forum.

I would not have you any other way. The scathing and venomous abuse you were subjected to on this forum as far as I know has had no precedent and I hope will not happen again to anyone and more especially you. I was surprised that more others had not come in to defend you. It was pretty obvious the effect it was going to and was meant to have on you.

Your approach was correct; when someone lives in fantasy land, they need reality there sitting on the edge of the bed come morning. You’re the best person for the job and we are so fortunate to have you here amongst us.

For me yours was and is the still, clear voice amongst all the well meant, but confused and conflicting advice.

Much love, Fab

Dear WW,

First of all, to Surviving...please know how very precious you are to all of us! Every one of your responses that I read, I nod my head and say to myself, Yep, I would've said that. You inspire me too! Believe it or not, I also need to be encouraged, reminded, supported and comforted...and the only way that can happen is through the posts you write to each other!

Let me just remind everyone that we never know who is posting on these forums. We have serious detractors in the world - anti-WW forums where they detest any mention of WW or WW posture. Pardon me if the recent insistence that you, Surviving, be silenced reminded me of that mindset.

I want to be very clear. This recent episode was not about needing help, support, compassion, or validation for success with kegels. It was about pushing some strange agenda. Women sign up for this forum every day and no one behaves in such a negative manner as we have seen over the last couple of days. Fair warning that it will not be tolerated again.

I agree Daphne, let's move on.

Christine

Perhaps I'm being naiive, but what I read from realistic's first post was that she was somewhat shocked and traumatised and looking for reassurance. I hope one of the moderators has at least contacted her privately to make sure she is okay, because I could read that with each post she was getting more upset and exasperated and emotional, and I didn't really see an agenda being pushed.

(sorry - not trying to restart anything, just concerned for someone's wellbeing)

Dear surviving

I know it is the current phrase to ask people ‘to move on’, with the good intention that it is not something that you should dwell upon and so relive the hurt caused by the original situation. Even our lady Prime Minister used ‘moving on’ in her election speech three years ago to emphasise the progress she would bring us to the degree of making everyone’s teeth grind, but I would like to suggest that you take time out and sit with that feeling of hurt, I am assuming you have pushed back down somewhere and just sit with it and let it move around your body at its own will. In other words, let it find its own way out. I think you will feel that emotion, within a few minutes, turn into something maybe surprising and then it goes. It is a great healing thing to do. If you are worried you will dissolve into further emotion allowing it out like this maybe wait until such a time as you are sitting quietly with a trusted friend who can share your silence and then evoke the feeling in the safety of your friend’s presence who need not know what you are doing.

After that there can be a true united body, mind and soul moving on.

Yes, definitely only a purely anecdotal suggestion. Looking forward to hearing from you again soon and often.

Cheers, Fab

Kiko, Thank you, Thank you for reading my posts and for hearing what I was trying to communicate.

I haven't written since Louise's reply because I wanted to give an appropriate response and be detailed on answering her question regarding what I wanted from this forum. But now I feel I cannot wait. I thought Louise gave me an excellent response barring she missed a very important detail that I wrote in my post, and that was, that my rectocele was gone and remains that way at present. My cystocele has stayed the same or gotten worse over the last 5 years. Did the Kegels help clear up the rectocele? Who knows! Do I still do kegels yes but as Louise stated they can harm you if not done correctly. Did they heal my cystocele, definitely not! I am not pushing Kegels. As I stated plainly in my posts what worked for me may not work for you. I have tried many things over the years.

As I stated over and over again in every post I am using WW Posture and doing the exercises and am doing tremendously. This last week I had the best results I have had in over a month. I want to be completely healed and who wouldn't but Louise brought this thought into perspective.

Christine and ladies I want all of you to know that it is not reasonable to assume that anyone of us can speak what is on our minds and use tough love and not expect to be confronted once in a while by someone who does not appreciate the way the advice or comment made them feel. I expressed how I felt to Surviving and asked her not to respond to my post. Why? She wasn't hearing me, she wasn't giving me what I needed at that moment in time. I needed compassion not tough love. I set a boundary for my own well being and that is all I did. This is healthy and if we cannot allow each other to set boundaries and express that what someone including you Christine is saying as being hurtful then this is not the place for me.

I may be the first and only woman who has ever come in here and expressed how they felt about a response but it is unacceptable to assume that I am a woman who has some kind of wicked agenda that everyone should be warned about. I accept all of the responsibility for the posts I wrote and if the responses I see are how all of you feel, then that is how you feel. I can only tell you where I am coming from the same way Surviving told me. Should I expect responses like you have given, of course you don't know me yet.

You can yell at me tell me mean things and say that my responses were abusive, venomous, and scathing and I hear you. I looked over my response to Surviving now that I am not in such an emotional state, and realize I could have told her in a more kind way that I would appreciate it if she did not respond to my posts because she was hurting me with her words.

Christine I have an agenda and that is to learn, share and be well. I was hurting and was hurt by the words surviving used in her post and that you also claimed above you would have told me when responding to my feelings of being violated by the Uro-Gyn.

She wrote:
You are in panic mode
You are hurting yourself

She said she was sorry and then went on to make excuses for saying what she said because of her excitement about WW. Well I wasn't excited, I was feeling like a victim and she was compounding it.

I asked for forgiveness from everyone that I might have hurt in the thread. I don't know surviving but I didn't want her to respond to me because her response was too harsh for me and I didn't think she was really listening to me. That is the way I felt.

I'm sure surviving has good intentions and so do you. I know many have encouraged her to keep on giving advice because they get encouragement from her posts.

Surviving you are not responsible for my healing or anyone's healing. We should however hold ourselves responsible for the way we make someone feel with our words and actions and wound them further.

I ask Christine and all of you once again including Surviving to please forgive me if I hurt or wounded you in any way with my posts.

Christine, I will leave if you feel that my presence and honesty is too much for this forum. If not, I am happy to stay, move on, learn and hopefully be an asset not a burden to this forum.

Thursday, April 23, 2009
Feel the way you choose
Whatever you feel on the inside, you will experience on the outside. Life reflects back to you the way you most sincerely and persistently are.
When you’re having a joyful day it’s because you’ve decided to do so. The world you see is directly related to the world you intend to see.
From nothing, in an instant, you can create joy. Where there was none before, you can express love.
Do you realize the awesome power in your ability to feel the way you choose to feel? With that power you can change the world.
You are extraordinarily skilled at changing your feelings, and you’ve had much experience at doing so. Feel the exquisite beauty of this moment, and watch as that beautiful feeling manifests in the world around you.
This is your moment to live more fully than you’ve ever lived. Feel the possibilities, and bring them joyfully to life.
— Ralph Marston
Read more: http://greatday.com/motivate/090423.html#ixzz2R1uQyFbS

Here's another one:
http://www.erinpavlina.com/blog/2006/11/choosing-our-emotions/

And another:
http://timmilburn.com/how-to-choose-a-positive-attitude-when-you-feel-ne...

also of interest: victim mentality, radical forgiveness

I think you need to understand that these forums are not meant to be personal therapy sessions. You received many quality responses, including those from Surviving. Nothing was ever said to you that was in any way inappropriate. Rather, from my perspective it was your self-centered responses that were way off base. You are right, you are the first one who has “confronted” us in such a manner. If I were you, I’d take a look at that. Understand that every post we write is intended for the entire community. Of course we make our responses as personal as possible, but they carry a theme of the best of what we (Louise, Surviving, Fab, Alemama, etc.) have learned over all these years. There may have been other members who picked up an inspiring tidbit from a particular word or turn of phrase in Surviving’s umpteenth post about the posture. How dare you try to silence our process! It is the responsibility of members to take what they need and leave the rest. It is lovely (but never expected) when members show gratitude for our efforts. It is equally unfortunate when we receive hostility instead. Surviving took time out of her busy day to respond to you, a stranger, and I am simply gobsmacked that you could respond in any way but with utmost grace and gratitude. You are not the only one who has been deeply violated by the system and it is only through compassion, patience, and tolerance that we survive together as a strong and healthy group of women. If you wish to stay, fine, but I request that you send a personal note of apology to Surviving.

Christine, Thank you for your kind words of understanding. I would be happy to send a private note to Surviving, can you tell me how to do it?

I have been away from this precious forum for many days now..... busy times. I just want you to know how much you have helped me and how much I enormously appreciate all that you do. I send you best wishes and much love.

I forgot that due to technical issues we can no longer directly email members. Please send your message to Louise (louiseds at wholewoman.com) and she will gladly send it along to Surviving.

i made a correction on louise's address which christine wrote incorrectly. just a heads up.

lanny

I have not read the thread with regards to surviving but would like to mention one thing please, we all come on this forum and take parts out of it which are helpful, I for one feel guilty as I am running round after my little boy so often come on read and ask for help but don't have the time to help others.. So please take in mind that surviving and many others take the time to answer everyone daily which thank god they do, please imagine how you would feel in your moment of need as I am a cryer as well if no one responded to your comments. I for one have been very grateful for everything said and if you think that parts not for you then that's fine I am sure but posture is the main point. So thanks again to everyone who takes the time And sorry I am not always here.

Surviving I know this is an older post but I just had to respond when I saw it. I am very new here n completely terrified of posting bc of mental n emotional problems posted else where. But u answered EVERY single one of my posts! You helped me w EVERY single one of my problems n at a time when I was showering myself in a thick waterfall of my own tears bc I couldn't get my words to come out right, to the point that they REALLY offended someone, YOU showed me such kindness! You made a woman who felt like she was nearing a complete emotional breakdown n that she was all alone w out a friend in the world feel like a REAL member of something so very special! You made me feel so special! You made a difference in my life to an extent that I will never be able to fully explain!!! In my darkest hour YOU were the light at the end of the tunnel! You took the time out of your busy schedule to help a complete stranger a NEW complete stranger! I will NEVER forget your kindness! You made my outlook on my misbehaving organs turn around completely! I am so thankful for ur posts n frankly if it wasn't for you I might not have stayed! But bc of your selfless compassion for a complete stranger I did stay n it is one of the best n most important decisions I have ever made! Don't u dare get discouraged!!! We luv you!! Newbies like me need your honest n life changing support!!! I know that bc of the massive difference u have made in my life there must be COUNTLESS others out there that are so grateful for the changes you have made in their lives! What I wouldn't give to have a friend like you in "real" life! The Lord doesn't make women like u very often and I think that the women lucky enough to know you in their "real" lives must feel so completely blessed! You r amazing n we need you n don't let any one make you feel otherwise!!! I am so lucky to be a member of this fantastic group of strong women!! Bless you Christine for your unconditional love n hard work for the benefit of complete strangers!!!!

The whole post was for surviving n the last sentence was for Christine! :)

Surviving,
just want to say, WMLB took the words right out of my mouth. I'm a newbie like her and so glad I found this forum. Your support is so important for us. You do a great job!!!

I've never considered you to be insensitive at all- direct, yes but not insensitive. I value and respect your directness and honesty but as we all may know, anyone's perception of us in any given moment is relative to how they are feeling in that moment. Sometimes I can be a bit too direct and people might interpret me as insensitive or haughty when I'm really just short on time. Likewise, I'm sure that I've been overly-sensitive at times about certain topics or constructive criticisms when I was feeling more vulnerable or insecure about myself. Given that you are such a conscientious and frequent participant in this forum who tries to respond to as many posts as you can, I'm surprised that you have time to respond as thoughtfully as you do!